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Thread: THE BIG ORCHESTRAL ACTION MUSIC THREAD!

  1. #76
    Is A Man tangotreats's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by arthierr View Post
    Thanks for this, dannyfrench! Just listening to it, great score but strangely enough the main theme by Danny Elfman isn't included (I mean the theme playing during the opening). Legal problems?
    Whoopsie!

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    streichorchester:

    Having listened to your piece several times now, and listening to the improved edition as we speak...

    The good: A fine piece of upbeat orchestral music - that would sound magnificent in a performance by a real orchestra.

    The bad: Quoting Kanno...? Shameless, absolutely shameless! Thieving from a thief who thieves from other thieves? And Gundam Stargazer? And Independence Day? Also, inevitably it is suffering through its synth performance (amazing job, Arthierr, but synth will never be the LSO...)

    The ugly: As you have said yourself, one of the hardest things about being a fan and a composer simultaneously, is that it becomes difficult to process your inspirations, filter them through your own musical psyche, and generate an original style. With your piece, I'm getting nothing that tells me it's *you* writing - with the utmost respect to you, my friend, this strikes me as more of a ten minute medley of other pieces by a massive roster of other composers, but where is Jeremy Robson in all this? What do you do the way nobody else does? What is there that people will, after extended exposure to your music, be able to hear and say "Oh yeah, that's Robson..." in the same way that you can say "That's Goldsmith / Williams / Poledouris..."?

    It seems like you're so caught up in emulating a particular technique, that you're short-changing your OWN influence in an effort to write something that fits the pattern. Something that Average Joe will hear and say it sounds like film music.

    Nobody's saying you have to completely reinvent the genre and start using nutty instruments. Nobody's saying that the old style isn't good any more. That's not the reason for my critique.

    Twenty people all sit in front of a cottage (a movie), are given canvases (manuscript paper) and a pot of watercolours (a symphony orchestra), and are instructed to adhere to limitations of technique - let's say they all must paint the cottage so it looks sensible and like a cottage, not do anything crazy, and they must use nothing except their brush and paints (write a symphonic score, don't include part for backwards tape, artillery shell, farting elephant, what have you). At the end, you have twenty pictures of your cottage (compositions). They all used the same materials but it's the way THEY saw it that gives it that uniqueness.

    To extend the analogy, it seems to me as though you saw the house, remembered what somebody else's picture of a house looked like, and took the facets of their picture and applied it to the house you had in front of you. Why? What's important is how it looked to YOU - and how your life experiences, artistic experiences, mood, personality, influenced you to paint in the way you did. Otherwise you have a workmanlike picture that anybody could've painted.

    I hope you will not be offended by this - a fine piece is a fine piece... But a man with your undoubted skill, impeccable taste, and the musical encyclopedia inside your head, shouldn't be short changing himself writing pastiche...

  2. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by dannyfrench View Post
    It seems like you're so caught up in emulating a particular technique, that you're short-changing your OWN influence in an effort to write something that fits the pattern. Something that Average Joe will hear and say it sounds like film music.

    I hope you will not be offended by this - a fine piece is a fine piece... But a man with your undoubted skill, impeccable taste, and the musical encyclopedia inside your head, shouldn't be short changing himself writing pastiche...
    No no, you got it right. It's SUPPOSED to be a collection of various techniques employed by composers, and the list of influences could go on to include Horner (Legend of Zorro), Silvestri (Eraser), Poledouris (Starship Troopers), etc. It's an experiment in various action styles and ostinato writing and sounds nothing like the more original action-oriented pieces you'd find on my webpage, although even they have their own set of influences.

    I've not heard Gundam Stargazer, though. Please tell me my theme (first heard at 0:45) isn't from there, because I thought that was pretty original when I came up with it.

  3. #78
    Is A Man tangotreats's Avatar
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    In that case, I'll shut up and say that it succeeds perfectly for what you were trying to achieve!

    Your melody doesn't remind me of anything - but it's hard to hear it underneath all that Kanno.

    I'm obviously not getting enough sleep, because I meant Gundam Stardust Memory - not Stargazer. This score is a) terrible, and b) THE most disgusting examples of plagiarism I have ever heard. If you think Kanno is bad, try this out for size:

    "Mitsuo Hagita - The Naval Review" (allegedly...) No further comment from me is necessary! Boy, did I yell when I heard this...

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    As far as the influence on your piece is concerned, refer to 4:33 and compare with the following... [Hidden link. Register to see links.]

    This example of probably pillaged shamelessly from something else (as is about 96% of Stardust Memory) so you'll probably be able to tell me what from, and no doubt that you fully intended to borrow from it.

    All the best
    D

  4. #79
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    AHAHAHAHAHAHHA HOLY SHIT!

    That's not Gundam, baby! That's ripped off of where I got the idea from too!

    edit: wow, was that Glory thing written before copyright laws existed in Japan or something??

    edit 2: in the spirit of this thread, here's the original action cue (not the Glory cue) in case anyone doesn't know the source [Hidden link. Register to see links.]

  5. #80
    Grand Shriner arthierr's Avatar
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    I've also found Star Trek II, I think, and in the past I found many quotations in some of your cues (Malta, Crusader...). But I know you're learning, that you'll certainly be a great composer with a unique style, but now you're experimenting, deconstructing ang reconstructing to train and gain skill.

    I draw a lot. Today I have my own style but when I was learning, my drawings seemed to be coming straight from "The savage sword of Conan" by Buscema/Alcala. It's natural to absorb the style and techniques of the masters you admire and then develop yours.

  6. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by arthierr View Post
    I've also found Star Trek II, I think, and in the past I found many quotations in some of your cues (Malta, Crusader...). But I know you're learning, that you'll certainly be a great composer with a unique style, but now you're experimenting, deconstructing ang reconstructing to train and gain skill.
    Hmm, I can't remember if I quoted Star Trek II, but that was definitely during my Conan-obsession period, which is what inspired me to write The Crusader.

  7. #82
    Grand Shriner arthierr's Avatar
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    Yes, just checked, 4:33 is much like 1:14 from Star Trek II - 19 - genesis countdown.
    And we can hear a similar 3 tuba notes at the beginning of Horner's cue.

    Edit : CRAP! Just listened to Brainstorm. I knew it was Horner! But still it's similar with ST2 with a faster tempo.

  8. #83
    Is A Man tangotreats's Avatar
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    Blast, of course it's Horner... The whole score is sodding Horner anyway! (By way of 2010 by Davis Shire...)

    I'm sorry, I didn't mean to turn this into a discussion about plagiarism.

    [Edit: F**K ME! (at the Gundam -> Brainstorm...)

  9. #84
    Grand Shriner arthierr's Avatar
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    Here is the first part of my Toshihiko SAHASHI's selection. Very, very talented composer, mastering all kinds of musical genres, he's extremely prolific in the anime area.

    It was really hard to choose because all his scores are loaded with superb action cues, so I greatly encourage you listen to the whole OSTs if you like these (and I bet you will).

    Black Blood Brothers - 19 - Shimei.mp3

    Black Blood Brothers - 29 - Haseru.mp3

    Black Blood Brothers - 43 - Gin Katana.mp3

    Capeta Ost - 09 - Capeta No Toushi.mp3

    Simoun Original Soundtrack 1 - 09 - Tsubasa To Tsubasa.mp3

    Simoun Original Soundtrack 1 - 10 - Tokubetsu Na Mira1 To Tameni....mp3

    Simoun Original Soundtrack 2 - 02 - Tatakau Sora No Hate.mp3

    The Big O Original Score - 03 - Stand A Chance.mp3

    The Cosmopolitan Prayers Complete Album - 08 - Tatakai 3.mp3

    Zipang Original Soundtrack - 35 - Battle Mirai.mp3

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    By the way, dannyfrench, don't you have some good SAHASHI scores to upload ?

  10. #85
    Is A Man tangotreats's Avatar
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    I do. And I will do so.

    And I will do my Sahashi compilation after all since you now seem to like compilations, Mr "No thanks, I Like To Listen To The Whole Score!"

  11. #86
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    Hey, Streichorchester
    I am absolutely in love with the music you posted on the last page, can you upload and post some more (even though it doesn't exactly fit into the threat, so you can mp me if its easier) I would really appreciate it. Whole albums would be nice if you got any..
    Thanks

  12. #87
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    Sure thing. I'm actually going to upload something a little different but it should impress if you like those "classical" selections.

  13. #88
    Grand Shriner arthierr's Avatar
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    May I suggest, Streich, that you allow people to listen to both of your superb orchestral suites that aren't in your website anymore : "Malta" and "Crusader".

    I've been lucky enough to get these in the past, but now it's gone.

  14. #89
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    arthierr:

    Those are old and embarrassingly badly orchestrated. I'm still hoping to one day redo them when I buy some massive sampling equipment, but I don't have the funds right now. Also, I don't want to spread around my midis as much as my recordings because I don't want James Horner getting a hold of them for when he needs ideas for Avatar.

    ---------------------------------------------------------

    Here's some more action music for those interested. I call this collection HARDCORE BALLET:

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    Bartok - The Miraculous Mandarin: It's not an easy listen - no standout themes or tonal center. It kind of bridges the gap between Bartok's colourful folk-like compositions and his forays into the avant-garde.

    Bartok - The Wooden Prince: Ah yes, much more thematically connected and down to earth. It's very reminiscent of Prokofievian ballet music or symphonies, which is why Horner used a bit of it in The Land Before Time.

    Borodin - Prince Igor: Folk dances and choirs and beautiful chomaticism in the themes. It's full of popular tunes, but lots of people don't actually realize they came from an opera written by a chemist in his spare time. The Polovetsian Dances make up the most spectacular segment of this opera, and can easily be considered ballet music.

    Copland - Rodeo: Speaking of popular tunes, everyone knows this one. Since Copland's music is so schizophrenic it's hard to find pieces that are through and through "action-oriented" so I went with the easy selection here you may remember from beef commercials. James Horner borrowed this sound for his score to An American Tail 2: Fievel Goes West.

    Khachaturian - Gayane: pronounced "guy-nuh". The most famous part from this is the Sabre Dance, but everyone's heard that a million times so I went with a more obscure selection. Also, you might recall Gayane's Adagio was used in the movie 2001: A Space Odyssey, and subsequently Horner's score to Aliens.

    Khachaturian - Spartacus: Does Khachaturian's genius know no bounds? He's perhaps one of the most underrated composers if you look at his more unpopular works such as this two-hour ballet. While the Adagio of Spartacus and Phrygia is everyone's favourite selection, for this I chose the Orgy at Crassus's Villa which was used to great effect in the movie The Hudsucker Proxy along with the Adagio.

    Khachaturian - The Valencian Widow: Another relatively unknown Khachaturian ballet that takes place during the Spanish Renaissance. It's a comedy, so it carries that patented Khachaturian snare ostinato in full force.

    Nielsen - Aladdin: The composer who will always be overshadowed by Sibelius was probably a better colourist than Sibelius as heard in his best work Aladdin. Yeah, he wrote six symphonies that people seem to like, but I can't for the life of me remember how they go even though I own all six.

    Prokofiev - Romeo and Juliet: Sergei Prokofiev, one of film scoring's godfathers, was just as good at writing ballets, if not better. His Romeo and Juliet proved he was just as good as Tchaikovsky, and earned him a spot as the 20th century's foremost ballet composer (along with Stravinsky.) James Horner steals quite a bit from this work, as heard in the selection here which can be found in the Stealing the Enterprise cue from Star Trek III: The Search for Spock.

    Prokofiev - Scythian Suite: After hearing Stravinsky's revolutionary The Rite of Spring, Prokofiev set out to do one better by writing a ballet called Ala and Lolli. He failed miserably (or so he thought) and the result is this colourful tale. James Horner used this in Battle Beyond the Stars.

    Ravel - Daphnis et Chloe: When I first heard this I was in awe of its majestic grandeur and colourful orchestrations, not to mention it was a ballet accompanied by full chorus. The themes and harmonies during the openings of both acts really stuck with me, but here I present the exciting finale as per the action-oriented nature of my selections. There are also portions of this ballet ripped off by Joel McNeely for his Shadows of the Empire faux-soundtrack.

    Shostakovich - The Golden Age: Here's a Russian composer who is actually NOT known for his ballet music, though he tried. For the most part they just seemed like extensions of his symphonies and film music, and don't carry the thematic inventiveness or pleasant listening experience of his Jazz Suites. This is only here because I'd hate to leave Shostakovich out. Go listen to his Jazz Suites and symphonies.

    Stravinsky - The Firebird: Stravinsky is mostly known for his three big ballets: The Rite of Spring, Petrouchka, and The Firebird. Of the three, The Firebird is the most "listenable" in suite form since the melodies are simple, the harmonies are simple, and the result is good ol' fashioned Tchaikovskian tradition. The more flowery sections seemed to have inspired John Williams for his score to Hook, but here I've selected the Infernal Dance heard in Fantasia 2000.

    Stravinsky - The Rite of Spring: I couldn't have made this collection of kick-ass ballet music and not included some selections from The Rite of Spring. Yeah, we all know the trivia: riots broke out at the premiere, John Williams borrows heavily from this, it scored the dinosaurs in Fantasia, etc. But did you know that Trevor Jones took a melody from this for his You Have the Power cue from Dark City? The more you know...

    Vaughan Williams - Job: Vaughan Williams is a great composer who can write some of the most beautiful pastoral music you've ever heard, but he has a dark side that can be seen in his symphonies nos 4 and 6, and this ballet. His symphonic scherzos are often reminiscent of the kind his BFF Holst wrote, but this is just weird. Cool, but weird.

    William Walton - The Quest: I think somewhere along the way Joel McNeely thought to himself "Gee, this ballet sounds a lot like Star Wars, so why don't I rip it off for Shadows of the Empire? No one will notice because who's ever heard of The Quest?" If you like Shadows of the Empire you will probably like The Quest, but if you LOVE Shadows of the Empire you'll hate The Quest for reminding you that Shadows is just a rip off of this. The selection here actually isn't any of the portions you hear in Shadows, but it's still awesome.

  15. #90
    Grand Shriner arthierr's Avatar
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    Phew! Awfully impressive! And remarkable comments, sure help to appreciate the music.

    Thanks!

  16. #91
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    Hey, Thanks streichorchester,
    Those are amazing!
    Arthierr mentioned something about your website. I was wondering if i could get a link to that. A simple google search didnt seem to turn up anything...

  17. #92
    Grand Shriner arthierr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghost117 View Post
    Hey, Thanks streichorchester,
    Those are amazing!
    Arthierr mentioned something about your website. I was wondering if i could get a link to that. A simple google search didnt seem to turn up anything...
    Please read Page 2 of this thread, it's all there.

  18. #93
    Grand Shriner arthierr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kreachure View Post
    I'm going to share now a few other songs I seemed to have overlooked for my first pack.
    Thanks, Kreachure! Just listened closely to you selection. Nice selection overall.

    I just love this magnificient 10+ minutes suite from Rescuers Down Under by Bruce Broughton. He's a very skilled and talented composer, but too much underrated.

    I remember hearing the main theme of Tintin some years ago, the first time I was totally amazed by this superb melody coupled with a strong rythm. Excellent choice!

  19. #94
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    Yeah, what ever happened to the Tintin guy? That was probably one of the most memorable themes I can remember from my childhood along with the animated Batman and Gargoyles.

  20. #95
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    this is a great idea ill compile some stuff and upload it within the next week
    click on these for music and other anime stuff
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    Want Ds Music go [Hidden link. Register to see links.]
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    BEST FORUM EVER (beside this one)
    4m4LIFE.com/forum

  21. #96
    Grand Shriner arthierr's Avatar
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    You're welcome, thanks!

    I don't have much personal time these days, so I'll do my best to update this thread from times to times as much as I can.

    That's why I greatly appreciate contributions so that everybody can keep enjoying the music.

  22. #97
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    First of all, I want to thank everyone that's been contributing to this thread. I've had an opportunity to listen to some 'new' or rather different material thanks to you guys.

    I do have a request to people using sendspace, if you can, please use sharebee or any other mirroring site when you upload the files, sendspace seems to max out at times and it's speed seems to drop drastically if you are browsing any other site

    I'm still going through the material here but right off the top I've liked the Scorpions, Metallica and Rage songs. I need to loop through the rest of the songs a couple of times to identify composer.

    Keep up the great work and keep sharing

    - The man

  23. #98
    Grand Shriner arthierr's Avatar
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    Today's update is a special orchestral versions of pop/rock songs. I've chosen on purpose upbeat and powerful music that can be used to illustrate action scenes. I'd like to know who the arrangers are because they did a fantastic job here! One I know is the great Louis Clarck who's an incredible arranger/orchestrator/conductor.

    Classic Police - Arrested.mp3

    Classic Queen - Flash.mp3

    Classic Queen - I Want It All.mp3

    Classic Rock - Eye of The Tiger.mp3

    Classic Rock - Get Back.mp3

    Louis Clark; Royal Philharmonic Orchestra - Toccata & Fuge in D Minor.mp3

    The London Symphony Orchestra - It's A Sin (Pet Shop Boys).mp3

    The London Symphony Orchestra - The Final Countdown (Europe).mp3

    The London Symphony Orchestra - Two Tribes, Relax (Frankie Goes To Hollywood).mp3

    The Munich Philharmonic Orchestra - Money, Money, Money.mp3

    The Sensation of Sound - Pop Goes Classic - St. Elmo's Fire.mp3

    And finally, *RARE* *RARE* *RARE* : this is a live recording from the music of "La Revue BONHEUR" from "le Lido de Paris" by Jean-Claude Petit. The music takes place in a medieval indian setting :

    La Revue BONHEUR - 18 - Les Guerriers.mp3

    La Revue BONHEUR - 19 - Le Palais de la Maharani.mp3

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    (asdfgh987652002 : Sharebee is limited to 100 mb, for bigger size I prefer sendspace, no need to truncate)

  24. #99
    Grand Shriner arthierr's Avatar
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    Streich, just finished to listen closely to your hardcore ballet. Very grand and powerful music, and nice orchestra performance.

    I only knew The Rite of Spring inside it. Concerning the classics I obviously know the tunes everybody heard thousand times, and a bit more because I also like to explore new good classical from times to times.

    But this selection is almost totally knew for me, I wish to thank you for that because one of the last place I usually go to find music is ballets (reminds me too much of balls hugged in stockings).

  25. #100
    Is A Man tangotreats's Avatar
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    Do you know The Queen Symphony? It fits in quite nicely with your classic rock posts. It is, as the name suggests, a full symphony constructed out of fragments and melodies of Queen songs.

    Those Louis Clark arrangements used to a bit of a guilty pleasure for me, back when I was getting into classical proper...

    Thud, CLAP, thud, CLAP, thud, CLAP! Those were the days...

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