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Thread: Is it really that good?

  1. #1
    Onion Kid Comeback-of-the-year's Avatar
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    Is it really that good?

    When i first bought XII i played on it for around an hour or two and really could not get into the new battle system. In the end i dug out my FFX and started that again, but after coming on this forum and hearing everyones love for XII i want to know is it really as good as its being made out to be?

    I guess i just want to know if the battle system grew on you and what was your first impression at the start of the game? Oh and is there a lot of mini game, side quests and extras to do? ive always enjoyed them in an FF.

  2. #2
    White Knight of Goodness Whispermyname's Avatar
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    I LOVE it. Tied with Civilization 3 for favorite video game of all time. At the beginning, they don't let you use the full combat system. Did you get to use gambits? There aren't really any mini games, but plenty of side quests.
    We remember Armitage.

  3. #3
    I'm watching you Erebus Wraith's Avatar
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    Meh, I didn't think the game was all that great. Granted the cut-scenes were pretty awesome but I got really bored with the game. For me it really really lacked the character development that I have come to know and love with FF games.

  4. #4
    Grand Shriner Trance Moogle's Avatar
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    The battle system at the start did seem like kind of a shock, but after beating the rogue tomato I got used to it. I probably enjoy the hunts the most. pretty much like optional monsters to fight but there are so many.

  5. #5
    White Knight of Goodness Whispermyname's Avatar
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    Character development is overrated. Farming is where its at.

  6. #6
    Grand Shriner RikkuYunaRinoa's Avatar
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    yeah, the battle system was a bit of a shock, but i think that it works, and i prefer it to the normal one, also, to the original poster, i think you need to give it more then two hours, it is a great game, especially when it opens up more.

  7. #7
    Exotic weapon proficiency ftw Prak's Avatar
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    I have to disagree. I found it interesting at the beginning and started to hate it as it dragged on and revealed its flaws.

  8. #8
    On the lookout for terrorists and liberals. Ceidwad's Avatar
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    Prak, have you actually played FFXII since the last time you posted about it?

  9. #9
    Exotic weapon proficiency ftw Prak's Avatar
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    Why would I have done so? I'm not a masochist. I dislike the game and I am quite certain I won't suddenly change that view.

  10. #10
    On the lookout for terrorists and liberals. Ceidwad's Avatar
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    Fair enough, that's your call. But if you're going to start a debate about it, you could probably do with actually knowing what goes on in the last 50% or so of the game.

  11. #11
    Grand Shriner ThroneofOminous's Avatar
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    If you want sidequests, FFXII actually has a lot of really cool ones. If you want a game like FFX though, don't bother. As JRPGs go, FFXII is almost the antithesis of FFX.

  12. #12
    Exotic weapon proficiency ftw Prak's Avatar
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    Wait just a moment... Are you trying to say (as people have been bashed for doing previously) that it's not enough that I find the first half to be horrific, and that I must force myself to play through the second half before my views will be credible?

    Ceidwad, you're smarter than that, so I really hope that wasn't your implication.

  13. #13
    On the lookout for terrorists and liberals. Ceidwad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThroneofOminous View Post
    If you want sidequests, FFXII actually has a lot of really cool ones. If you want a game like FFX though, don't bother. As JRPGs go, FFXII is almost the antithesis of FFX.
    And yet I enjoyed both FFX and FFXII, even though I prefer FFX. And many others are the same. I don't think that if you like FFX, you'll auotmatically dislike FFXII and vice versa. Some people do feel that way though, it's true.

  14. #14
    Onion Kid Comeback-of-the-year's Avatar
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    I think im going to give it another shot, i just have to wait for it back off a friend i lent it to. I went round his house the other day when he was on it and he'd got rid of those attack lines (which were one of the things that really annoyed me).

  15. #15
    On the lookout for terrorists and liberals. Ceidwad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prak View Post
    Wait just a moment... Are you trying to say (as people have been bashed for doing previously) that it's not enough that I find the first half to be horrific, and that I must force myself to play through the second half before my views will be credible?

    Ceidwad, you're smarter than that, so I really hope that wasn't your implication.
    I am merely saying that your position in a debate about it could be tenuous because you don't know what goes on in the second half of the game. You may have valid views about the first half, but unless you've actually seen the conclusion others will be able to argue against your points by citing things from the rest of the game that you won't be able to counter. If we had a debate about it now, I feel I could probably argue pretty competently against your views.

  16. #16
    Grand Shriner ThroneofOminous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ceidwad_yr_Arfau View Post
    And yet I enjoyed both FFX and FFXII, even though I prefer FFX. And many others are the same. I don't think that if you like FFX, you'll auotmatically dislike FFXII and vice versa. Some people do feel that way though, it's true.
    I didn't say that someone who likes FFX would automatically dislike FFXII. I said that if he expects a game like FFX, he's going to be disapointed.

  17. #17
    On the lookout for terrorists and liberals. Ceidwad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThroneofOminous View Post
    I didn't say that someone who likes FFX would automatically dislike FFXII. I said that if he expects a game like FFX, he's going to be disapointed.
    Ok, misunderstood you there.

  18. #18
    Exotic weapon proficiency ftw Prak's Avatar
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    I have to disagree with you, Ceidwad. I can make a perfectly viable (perhaps even bulletproof) argument that if the first half of the game is bad, there is little incentive to see the rest of it, thus separating our arguments into completely separate and incompatible categories. At that point, you would either have to engage in debate on my terms or disengage completely.

  19. #19
    On the lookout for terrorists and liberals. Ceidwad's Avatar
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    OK, let me use an analogy. You're acting like someone who picks up a Bible, reads it to Deutoronomy, and promptly claims to know everything about Christianity.

    To use a more relevant counter-argument, you have often defended FFX-2 (sometimes from me, sometimes from others) as being something good because it rewards those that persevere and explore it further. Now I'd argue that a good chunk of FFXII's merit comes from its optional content and obviously the character development that occurs late on in the game. If you've used that argument before, it seems irrational to dismiss it when I use the same thing to defend something else.

    Or maybe I'm missing something here?

    If we disagree, we disagree, fine. I have no problem with that. I only have a problem with you claiming that your opinions are nothing short of absolute truth based on having played half the game.

  20. #20
    Would you like to see my mask? Nightowl9910's Avatar
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    Unfortunately I've still not had the chance to give this one a go so am in no position to comment on the game personally.

    But I would advise anyone, who's in the least bit interested in how good a game really is or isn't, not to go by first impressions as a result of just a few minutes of gameplay. Or even just a few hours if it happens to be a game as long as this one. Give it a proper chance by playing it through to the end, if you can bring yourself to muster up the patience. You're not likely to get an accurate idea about it otherwise.

    Of course, someone deciding not to continue with a game because they've simply decided it's not their thing taste wise is another matter.
    Dr Crane isn't here right now, but if you'd like to make an appointment....

  21. #21
    Exotic weapon proficiency ftw Prak's Avatar
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    I have never claimed that my views on FFXII are anything other than my own perspective. It is, however, based in fact, and thus gives me a launching point for debating the issue. There is nothing at all wrong with debating one's own perspective strongly, provided that there are facts to support it, and you should have noticed that I only carry a debate as far as my experience with the issue will allow.

    As for X-2, the optional segments I've defended are present throughout the entire game, not concentrated in the second half. Also, don't misquote me. I don't claim that FFX-2 is a grand masterpiece of game design. It isn't. No matter how heavily it's updated, it's still based in outdated gameplay systems and chock full of dubious design choices that balance with its merit. All I do is defend the game against those whose hatred of it defies logic.

  22. #22
    IT'S A TRAP Zak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prak View Post
    As for X-2, the optional segments I've defended are present throughout the entire game, not concentrated in the second half. Also, don't misquote me. I don't claim that FFX-2 is a grand masterpiece of game design. It isn't. No matter how heavily it's updated, it's still based in outdated gameplay systems and chock full of dubious design choices that balance with its merit. All I do is defend the game against those whose hatred of it defies logic.
    Quoted for truth. X-2 is one of the few games that, though mediocre, a lot of people's hatred for it does indeed defy logic.

    But I would still be interested in hearing your arguement against FFXII, cause I dunno if I'm missing anything, but from what I see you keep saying you can have a very valid arguement for your dislike of it despite having only played through the first half, yet you have yet to present it. I'm not saying it's impossible, I'm just interested in hearing it.
    For all we know it may also "defy logic" the same way a lot of people's dislike for X-2 does, then again it could be legit. But it seems like as long as you haven't presented it yet, a lot of people here will assume the former, so go ahead, prove them wrong.

  23. #23
    On the lookout for terrorists and liberals. Ceidwad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prak View Post
    As for X-2, the optional segments I've defended are present throughout the entire game, not concentrated in the second half. Also, don't misquote me. I don't claim that FFX-2 is a grand masterpiece of game design. It isn't. No matter how heavily it's updated, it's still based in outdated gameplay systems and chock full of dubious design choices that balance with its merit. All I do is defend the game against those whose hatred of it defies logic.
    I never quoted you as saying that. Furthermore, XII is exactly the same as X-2 in that its optional content is present throughout the game. The whole point of my previous post was to try and show you the paralell between the two games in the hope that you might lay off XII.

  24. #24
    Exotic weapon proficiency ftw Prak's Avatar
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    Pardon my lack of clarity. You did misquote me in that you said that I claimed X-2 was good because of that. I have only ever brought up that point about optional content when someone attacked what they perceived to be a lack of story.

    And anyway, you're running in circles now and I'm not entirely sure about what you're trying to say. First you (seemingly) took the position that the second half of FFXII contained enough merit to redeem the first, but now you claim that the first half's merit was hidden? I'm quite confused, but to be perfectly honest, I don't really care if you clarify your stance or not. I have no intention of actually debating the issue at present. That isn't to say I won't be drawn in by continued replies, but my heart won't be in it.

    Zak, I'm sorry to disappoint you, but I simply can't be bothered. It just doesn't matter enough to me to try. If you're really interested in my views, feel free to PM me with specific questions about them, and I'll reply whenever the mood strikes me to do so. Anyway, I have very little to prove to most people around here, as they know me to be quite reasonable.

  25. #25
    On the lookout for terrorists and liberals. Ceidwad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Prak View Post
    Pardon my lack of clarity. You did misquote me in that you said that I claimed X-2 was good because of that. I have only ever brought up that point about optional content when someone attacked what they perceived to be a lack of story.

    And anyway, you're running in circles now and I'm not entirely sure about what you're trying to say. First you (seemingly) took the position that the second half of FFXII contained enough merit to redeem the first, but now you claim that the first half's merit was hidden? I'm quite confused, but to be perfectly honest, I don't really care if you clarify your stance or not. I have no intention of actually debating the issue at present. That isn't to say I won't be drawn in by continued replies, but my heart won't be in it.
    Not at all. I'll start again. What I am trying to say is that the parts of XII you played have a lot more merit when you take into account what happens after around Archades, and seeing those events would reveal more about the plot. XII's mandatory plot moves along pretty slowly but trust me, it is worth perseverance.

    The point about the optional content is another argument altogether and the optional missions are often available from the beginning, often being sidequests which branch off from hunts or main plot events. That is where the FFX-2 paralell comes into play.

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