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Thread: Why i think ff7 fails

  1. #1
    Grand Shriner
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    Why i think ff7 fails

    1:Sephiroth has the make of a better tragic anti hero than cloud could ever dream of.His past and all would have made him a very tragic hero that you could believe.Instead,he was put in the position as a half ass villain.

    2:The villain gets nowhere near enough screen time and dialogue to develop the relationship between all characters.Do you guys admit that kefka has way more dialogue and appearance? After all:When is the first time we see sephiroth? first sign is at shinra hq,and even then we don't see him.Next timeream sequence of him.This scene alone proves that sephiroth would have made a better hero than a villain,along with the scene where he talks about his mother and feels sad and gets angry at being experimented on,besides:How many of you would like to have a main char with a katana? katana weapons are kinda cool.Sephiroth gets a few scenes,and all of them are in the dream sequences.We don't get to see the real one till the very end,and by then:He says nothing at all when we fight him.No motivational speech to hate him,and no speech on anything.

    3:Character connections are very important.I think sephiroth is maybe connected to three characters:Cloud tifa and vincent.The rest are more connected to shinra as a whole,which leaves the game with little connection to the villain between all of them.
    Kefka is connected to each and every character.He harmed all of them in one way or another,cept maybe gogo.But gogo umaro and mog were all hidden characters,and we don't know anything about them.I got a really good reason to hate kefka,but i can't think of any reason why i should hate sephiroth.While i felt sad for aeris,it was because she was innocent,but even then,i felt little for her.

    4:The end.I was a bit disappointed with the ending itself.One bit that kind of disappointed me,was the bit with red XIIII.I saw him running around with his children and wonderedid the world get destroyed? what happened to cloud? I was confused as to what happened.

  2. #2
    Onion Kid
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    The introduction of Sephiroph was quite Genius. All this time we have been battling the Shinra. We climbed the plate and infiltarted the Shinra HQ progressing through each floor. Then Sephiroph is introduced, but by that time we have no idea what he looks like.

    When Cloud tells the story he says "Sephirophs strength was greater in reality than any story or legend". Woo this really stir things up. And his 2 meter long katana!
    You said a Katana is a cool weapon that would suit a main character. But a 2 meter katana is something else, it is menacing, a perfect weapon for a villan.

  3. #3
    Ultros' New Sidekick JohnnyMercyside's Avatar
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    1. Good point in a way, you did feel sorry for Sephiroth in the story Cloud tells you. However his actions, manipulating Cloud, killing Aeris, destroying Nibelheim, killing Tifa's dad, getting the Black Materia and summoning Meteor all make him an awesome villain I think. But each to their own.

    2. Sephiroth gets quite a lot of TV time, obviously through Jenova, but at the time you don't know that. He gets more than Kefka in this respect, but if that doesn't count then I suppose not, but his essence, his persona and his agenda are all clear and carry the storyline from very early right to the very end.

    3. You don't always need all characters to connect to the main villain. All FF7s characters have their own agendas which tie in with killing Sephiroth. Don't forget that Sephiroth was to destroy the whole world, so everyone was fighting to save it as well.

    4. Yeah I think FF7s ending is poor but it does enough to satisfy me, just killing Sephiroth with Omnislash is awesome.

    When I saw the title of the thread I thought you were insinuating that FF7 failed. It was the most successful FF title of all time. I think you are trying to say that Squaresoft failed with Sephiroth, which as you can see I don't agree with you completely but I see where you are coming from in some parts. I personally love Sephiroth, not as much as Kefka, but I thought overall he was a brilliantly badass villain that satisfied me immensely.
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    Onion Kid
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    1:Sephiroth has the make of a better tragic anti hero than cloud could ever dream of.His past and all would have made him a very tragic hero that you could believe.Instead,he was put in the position as a half ass villain.
    I disagree; Sephiroth as an anti-hero would be pretty hard to manage. Consider that the approach to the protagonist in this game is that his history (everything that happened prior to the start of this game) is meant to serve as the primary motivation for the protagonist's action and overall journey. Sure, Cloud get's the extra motivation of revenge when Sephiroth kills Aeris, but in terms of overall story arc, the plot is very much driven by Cloud's journey of self-discovery and his desire to set himself apart as a unique, important warrior in the world. He wants to stop living in Zack's shadow and be recognized for his own strength and achievements. This is all symbolically achieved by destroying Sephiroth, in addition to the more literal goals of saving the goddamn world and avenging the murder of the woman he loved.

    I don't think this kind of motivation could be obtained from Sephiroth's backstory; he has nothing to prove and nothing to achieve, he's just angry at the world for what he views as a grave injustice that has been perpetrated against him. I don't know if you've ever played Dungeons and Dragons, but from both a DM and a player's perspective, a player character that despises all life for the injustices the character has suffered is almost impossible to work into a storyline without breaking character. It's just too hard for the player or the DM to come up with a sufficient reason why the character would put aside such a deeply rooted hatred to benefit those he/she hates. Video games work pretty much the same way; given Sephiroth's history and his response to discovering the whole JENOVA secret, I can't see any way that Sephiroth could become anything other than a villian.

    There's also the problem of protagonist growth: the main character in any game, book or movie, needs to go through some sort of personal growth. In RPG's that growth is two-fold; First the character becomes stronger through the battles he/she fights until they are capable of facing the final boss, and second the character experiences some major personal growth. Cloud finds his identity and becomes a person of his own, rather than just pretending to be Zack. Sephiroth *could* have some character growth in the personal growth area, but at the start of the game he's the strongest SOLDIER, and pretty much the most powerful individual in the world. There's no opportunity for him to grow stronger; he's already the baddest dude alive.

    You also said he's a half-ass villain, but I disagree here as well; Sephiroth manipulates Cloud constantly with visions and illusions, and is constantly just out of reach. He's almost taunting Cloud through the entire game, engaging in some pretty heavy psychological warfare.


    2:The villain gets nowhere near enough screen time and dialogue to develop the relationship between all characters.Do you guys admit that kefka has way more dialogue and appearance? After all:When is the first time we see sephiroth? first sign is at shinra hq,and even then we don't see him.Next timeream sequence of him.This scene alone proves that sephiroth would have made a better hero than a villain,along with the scene where he talks about his mother and feels sad and gets angry at being experimented on,besides:How many of you would like to have a main char with a katana? katana weapons are kinda cool.Sephiroth gets a few scenes,and all of them are in the dream sequences.We don't get to see the real one till the very end,and by then:He says nothing at all when we fight him.No motivational speech to hate him,and no speech on anything.

    It's a thing called suspense. Horror movies use this kind of "Hide the badguy" technique all the time because it creates a hook for the audience; Who is the badguy? What are his goals, his motivations? What is he capable of? The complete answers to these questions are kept from us, but we are constantly learning more about him through the clues he leaves behind and the instances where he uses his powers.

    You made a comparison to Kefka, but Kefka was an entirely different monster; he wasn't an expert warrior, he wasn't someone that would or could go out and accomplish major goals or slay giant monsters, at least not initially. He was powerful, and he wasn't above getting his hands dirty when necessary, but he worked mostly through manipulating others into doing his job for him. Subversion and manipulation were his tools. A character like that HAS to be given a large amount of dialogue and appearance, because his impact on the plot is entirely contained in his dialogue and appearances.

    Contrast this with Sephiroth, who regularly kills just about everything in his way because he's the strongest SOLDIER the ever have existed. Put aside his powers of manipulation and you've still got a force of destruction. Hell, the first time you're introduced to Sephiroth is through a trail of blood through the headquarters of the most powerful(only?) political/business entity in the world. The next time you see him, you've just used a Chocobo to outrun a Midgar Zolom, a giant snake that, if you try to just fight, absolutely obliterates your party. What do you see once you've gotten across the swamp where this snake resides? The corpse of a Midgar Zolom on display for you, left by Sephiroth. Sephiroth is a whirlwind of destruction and death. He doesn't waste time with subversion or manipulation to accomplish his major goal with meteor and the lifestream and all that. He's direct and to the point; Kefka would get a ruler to go into the swamp with him, leave the ruler to die to the snake while Kefka sneaks past and simultaneously seizes control of that ruler's country, Sephiroth just walks up and kills the goddamn snake. No elaborate plans or long-winded monologues needed; Sephiroth gets his point across and achieves his goals through his own actions, mostly because he's the most powerful individual in the world.

    Again you bring up that his feeling sad/angry about being experimented on would make him a great hero, but he's not really sad so much as mentally unhinged, and angry is a bit of an understatement. He seeks to destroy everyone and everything and become a god. His mental state following the JENOVA discovery is the most realistic possible, but it's a mental state that doesn't allow for any kind of action that we would consider "good". He sees himself as superior to everyone on the planet, and views them as tools to be used for his eventual transition into godhood.

    As for having a main character with a katana, that's really a silly argument. Cloud's Buster Sword at least has significance to his character in that it represents the identity he *stole* from Zack. Sephiroth's weapon is insiginificant in every way; it's just an insanely powerful weapon that the already insanely powerful antagonist uses.

    Finally you again complain that Sephiroth pretty much doesn't say anything. Once again, Sephiroth isn't a boring, cliche villian that delivers one-liners and monologues. In a way, those sorts of exchanges that we are used to in our antagonists are an expression of weakness in the antagonist. It's an ego thing: "Appreciate my evil yet brilliant plan and acknowledge my superiority before I kill you!" Sephiroth doesn't have the weakness of such a frail ego. He's brilliant and superior to everyone, and he knows it. He doesn't need the acknowledgement or appreciation of those he is superior to. Wasting words on such insignificant beings is beneath him, so he doesn't waste time with it. Sephiroth toys with Cloud's mind by constantly tricking Cloud into believing he is about to catch up with Sephiroth, but that's more for his own amusement, and perhaps for revenge after Cloud unexpectedly overpowered Sephiroth in the Shinra reactor during the Nibelheim incident. He doesn't deliver that motivational speech to hate him because it's beneath him to speak to someone so pathetic, and from a plot construction perspective, we don't NEED that speech because we already have enough reason to hate him; he's trying to kill everyone and become a god, and he killed Aeris. Sephiroth lacks the boring, cliche flaw of most villians and has an ego that doesn't need to be stoked (instead being narcissistic to a genocidal degree) which I'd say is definitely a good thing!



    3:Character connections are very important.I think sephiroth is maybe connected to three characters:Cloud tifa and vincent.The rest are more connected to shinra as a whole,which leaves the game with little connection to the villain between all of them.
    Kefka is connected to each and every character.He harmed all of them in one way or another,cept maybe gogo.But gogo umaro and mog were all hidden characters,and we don't know anything about them.I got a really good reason to hate kefka,but i can't think of any reason why i should hate sephiroth.While i felt sad for aeris,it was because she was innocent,but even then,i felt little for her.

    You should hate Sephiroth because he murders without cause or restraint. You should hate Sephiroth because he is unleashing hell on the planet in the form of the Weapons, and he is calling down a Meteor that is meant to wipe out all life, simply so that he can become more powerful. The only character truly connected to Sephiroth is Cloud; Cloud has a personal vendetta against Sephiroth for killing Aeris and because killing Sephiroth is a way for Cloud to obtain selfhood. The rest of the characters want to stop Sephiroth because he's trying to kill everyone on the planet. Wanting to stop planet-wide genocide is a pretty good motivation for most characters =P

    4:The end.I was a bit disappointed with the ending itself.One bit that kind of disappointed me,was the bit with red XIIII.I saw him running around with his children and wonderedid the world get destroyed? what happened to cloud? I was confused as to what happened.

    This could have been done better I suppose, but a lot of the aftermath is covered more in depth by Advent Children, Dirge of Cerberous and the other post-meteor games that have been released.

  5. #5
    SOLDIER CLOUD ZANZA's Avatar
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    ... FF7 is the best selling, highest rated and most downloaded Game in history. That speaks for itself, and i along with many people feel that the game couldn't have been done better.
    jeremyduh likes this.

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    Onion Kid
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    Quote Originally Posted by CLOUD ZANZA View Post
    ... FF7 is the best selling, highest rated and most downloaded Game in history.
    Um, no. Not by a long shot. Pokemon Red, Green, and Blue, Tetris, Wii Sports, Gran Turismo, Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas, Ape Escape, Pacman, and even Angry Birds have all outsold Final Fantasy VII. [Hidden link. Register to see links.]. Also, it is not nearly as highly rated as you think. Games like Ocarina of Time, Soul Caliber, and Final Fantasy IX have all received higher ratings than Final Fantasy VII. [Hidden link. Register to see links.]. So get your facts right before make a completely exaggerated claim like the one you just made.

    Quote Originally Posted by CLOUD ZANZA View Post
    That speaks for itself, and i along with many people feel that the game couldn't have been done better.
    Would you honestly say that the game is flawless? As in, there is nothing to improve? For instance, the combination of dialogue elements needed to acquire Yuffie, which has no rhyme or reason and practically requires a strategy guide was a great decision in your opinion? The character design of Cloud with muscles shaped like basketballs connected to pipecleaners is impossible to improve? And making our protagonist cross-dress and rewarding the player for getting the perfect dress combination (again, which is never directly stated) and also having the option of getting him gangraped in a spa was a good idea? Look, I'm not hating on FFVII, because I like the game. But saying that it's a perfect game that "couldn't have been done better" is engaging in hyperbole. I don't think anyone would say that.

  7. #7
    Grand Shriner FF7genie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nostalgia gamer View Post
    1:Sephiroth has the make of a better tragic anti hero than cloud could ever dream of.His past and all would have made him a very tragic hero that you could believe.Instead,he was put in the position as a half ass villain.

    2:The villain gets nowhere near enough screen time and dialogue to develop the relationship between all characters.Do you guys admit that kefka has way more dialogue and appearance? After all:When is the first time we see sephiroth? first sign is at shinra hq,and even then we don't see him.Next timeream sequence of him.This scene alone proves that sephiroth would have made a better hero than a villain,along with the scene where he talks about his mother and feels sad and gets angry at being experimented on,besides:How many of you would like to have a main char with a katana? katana weapons are kinda cool.Sephiroth gets a few scenes,and all of them are in the dream sequences.We don't get to see the real one till the very end,and by then:He says nothing at all when we fight him.No motivational speech to hate him,and no speech on anything.

    3:Character connections are very important.I think sephiroth is maybe connected to three characters:Cloud tifa and vincent.The rest are more connected to shinra as a whole,which leaves the game with little connection to the villain between all of them.
    Kefka is connected to each and every character.He harmed all of them in one way or another,cept maybe gogo.But gogo umaro and mog were all hidden characters,and we don't know anything about them.I got a really good reason to hate kefka,but i can't think of any reason why i should hate sephiroth.While i felt sad for aeris,it was because she was innocent,but even then,i felt little for her.

    4:The end.I was a bit disappointed with the ending itself.One bit that kind of disappointed me,was the bit with red XIIII.I saw him running around with his children and wonderedid the world get destroyed? what happened to cloud? I was confused as to what happened.

    hater.. im guessing u were in the late 20's early 30's when this came out... you couldnt handle the advancements from snes to playstation haha. that is why alot of ppl that dis the game is because they were older an couldnt handle the breakthrough tech of the ps 1, is 14 buttons 2 much for you bud? like my mom, shes a beast at atari but when i hand her the double joystick ps 1 controler she dont know what to do. either thats ur problem or your to young an never got to experience it before the ps 3 an 360 came out...See i was 9 years old when this came out it was everything i was lookiing for. an my mom got it for christmas for me along with a brand new playstation..i was brought up on games like zelda and pitfall.. most kids around my age were brought up on toy story and sports games...

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    Grand Shriner LordBlackudder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CLOUD ZANZA View Post
    ... FF7 is the best selling, highest rated and most downloaded Game in history. That speaks for itself, and i along with many people feel that the game couldn't have been done better.

    i think angry birds is catching up. all hail angry birds!

    i can't stand any ff's actually. the story telling is terrible, the gameplay is atrocious. ff7 is no exception.
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    Grand Shriner
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    um no, i just think ff7 is vastly overrated, and i prefer ff6 ff4/tactics.I can't decide, since i like ramza delita teta and gafgarion was cool, even for a traitor who sold out.After that, ff9, and after that FFX, and somewhere in between, ff5, then ff7, and the two last games are ff8, then FFXIII.FF7 is one of the last games i would play if given a choice.

    As for ff7 commentary:I don't find sephiroth menacing at all, i found him a worthless excuse for his actions, and he keeps dying like ganon.Personally, i think hojo is scarier.Most of the time, its jenova who kills.hojo made sephiroth, so hojo is dr frankenstein, in that he doesn't care who he hurts, as long as he furthers his career.Look at him in crisis core, with his creepy laugh as zack goes into the virtual mode machine.

    Second:A tragic hero connected to the story works.The monster in frankenstein, wasn't the thing revived, it was the doctor, so it could be made to work.

    Personally, i think sephiroth is a bad villain.I did not find him believable, and i felt nothing for the party, except for cid and zach.I liked zach a whol lot more than overrated cloud strife.

  10. #10
    jen' jari iv tave sith Darth Revan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CLOUD ZANZA View Post
    ... FF7 is the best selling, highest rated and most downloaded Game in history. That speaks for itself, and i along with many people feel that the game couldn't have been done better.
    Please provide proof from a reputable website to back up this claim.

    Quote Originally Posted by FF7genie View Post
    hater.. im guessing u were in the late 20's early 30's when this came out... you couldnt handle the advancements from snes to playstation haha. that is why alot of ppl that dis the game is because they were older an couldnt handle the breakthrough tech of the ps 1, is 14 buttons 2 much for you bud? like my mom, shes a beast at atari but when i hand her the double joystick ps 1 controler she dont know what to do. either thats ur problem or your to young an never got to experience it before the ps 3 an 360 came out...See i was 9 years old when this came out it was everything i was lookiing for. an my mom got it for christmas for me along with a brand new playstation..i was brought up on games like zelda and pitfall.. most kids around my age were brought up on toy story and sports games...
    I don't usually back up nostalgia gamer, however I do agree with him regarding FFVII. You say you were 9 years old when this game came out, well, back in 1997 when it was released I was 19 and even then I thought while it was a ok game, it was nothing really special as there were other games which were superior imo at that time (I'm talking about on the PC... Hell, Breath of Fire II was better than this). The game now IS overrated by those who think it's the second coming of Christ and think it's the epitome of the perfect game. It didn't deserve the prequels, sequels etc or even that damn movie. Sephiroth was the biggest momma's boy ever, Cloud was a dupe for 90% of the game and the rest... psssh.

    There are multiple reasons why people don't like this game, conversely there are reason why people love it. What I despise is when the people from the latter group still say to this day, 15 years after this game's release, that it is superior to other games available now.

    Side note FF7genie, work on your spelling and grammar. That post of yours was atrocious to read.


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    Grand Shriner
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    You and i agree about a lot of stuff on FFXIII.Thing is though, i never played knights of the old republic, so i have no opinion on it yet.So far from what i've seen about FFXII in voice acting and gameplay, it seems leagues better than FFXIII, especially in gameplay.That game is so friggin huge.

  12. #12
    Onion Kid
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    Quote Originally Posted by FF7genie View Post
    Hater...I'm guessing you were in your late 20's/early 30's when this came out... you couldn't handle the advancements from SNES to Playstation, haha. That is why a lot of people diss the game: it is because they were older and couldn't handle the breakthrough technology of the PS1. Are 14 buttons too much for you, bud? It's like my mom; she's a beast at Atari but when I hand her the double-joystick PS1 controller, she doesn't know what to do. Either that's your problem or you're too young and never got to experience it before the PS3 and 360 came out... See, I was 9 years old when this came out and it was everything I was looking for. And [Don't begin a sentence with "and"] my mom got it for Christmas for me along with a brand new Playstation...I was brought up on games like Zelda and Pitfall, whereas most kids around my age were brought up on Toy Story and sports games...
    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Revan View Post
    FF7genie, work on your spelling and grammar. That post of yours was atrocious to read.
    Seconded.

    By the way, FF7genie, if you were 9 years old when Final Fantasy 7 came out and posted this atrocious message in 2012, that means you're 24 years old and writing like an eight-year-old. Please proof-read your posts, and don't include god-awful poor writing that makes it difficult to figure out what you're saying, especially if your point is just, "I was young, you were old, I got it, you didn't."
    Last edited by Olde; 08-17-2012 at 01:00 PM.
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  13. #13
    Grand Shriner
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    I have a few things to point out ff7genie

    1:My age is not 100% important.Besides:20-30 in 97? not even close.I was from the beginning of final fantasy.I can enjoy a game, but it depends on what i like.Granted, i don't like whiny melodramatic teen soap opera, and i don't like anime.I never got into it, so i wouldn't be interested in it now.

    2:You should pay respect to us older generation.What are you, an ageist or something? I might have more experience than you, since you also gain a different perspective with age.I for an example, i apreciate some wrpgs, because of my exposure years.I am also less jaded than some of the younger generation.Thing is, ff7 and up, brought teen japanimation rpgs with bad melodrama.The late 90's was the beginning, but things went downhill for final fantasy, after enix bought them, and ruined for me a series i loved.When i see S.E, i see corporations trying to cash in on popular titles, and ruin their reputation with linear interactive movies with boring teen jpop, like FFXIII.If they want my vote, they will need to earn my faith in the serie, by making a game that is as fun to play, as it is interesting in story.

    3:I played wrpgs, and jrpgs.I even played jrpgs from other companies.How many games from other companies do you play, other than square enix? If you only stick to one company, you may want to try others, because there are some great series out there.I personally really like kings field series.It has this dark creepy overtone, and the second game is way better.Suikoden series, is made by konami, which also made metal gear solid series.

    4:You shouldn't be so hostile to someone's opinions.Instead of flamming and trolling me, try and convincing me by pointing out thing.If you fail, it is possible thatI already made up my mind, in which we will need to agree to disagree, or your point fails because you failed to make any good points.Shouting obsceneties at me while flamming will not help you, as i will not be threatened into submission.The spanish inquisition was over hundreds of years ago.

    5:My spelling is obviously far from perfect, and i think you should take it slowly to correct your grammatical errors.

  14. #14
    Onion Kid
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nostalgia gamer View Post
    Do you guys admit that kefka has way more dialogue and appearance?
    Yep. I admit he had way more dumb dialogue and sissy appearance.

    Seriously, I only think about Kefka when thinking about the worst fiction villains ever. To me, comparing him to Sephiroth (or any other villain, for that matter) is either joking or trolling.

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    Just a normal dude... AFMG's Avatar
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    What I think (my 2 cents) is that FFVII sucks. And not because is cool to say it. Look, at that point I had played FF1, 4 (6) and other RPGs. I didn't know back then that FFVII marked the end of an era and the begining of the "pretty boys with 'deep' problems" that has plagued RPGs since then, but I perceived something had changed in that moment. Obviosly for me it was more related to presentation and graphics. For me, FFVII won an entire generation because it blowed their minds: the settings, the world, the story, the characters, the music, etc. It doesn't plainly sucks, because it has many, many good elements, but honestly it wasn't THAT great. It's just that there wasn't anything like that. It has to earn some respect for what it did in that POINT in history. What it represented to RPGs, to gaming in general. Was it REALLY a good game. No. I can't possibly have the time, nor the resources to point every flaw, every mistake it commits because I'm not an expert and some people (like Pitchfork at Socksmakespeoplesexy) have done better. Let's just say that I appreciate that the particular moment in time it was released was the perfect oportunity to engrave itself in the position everyone remembers.
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  16. #16
    Grand Shriner
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    Dear AFMG:

    Some peopl hate specific characters.I can't stand cloud because of his personality, and ill gotten fame by cult fanboys.Sephiroth, because:In my opinion, he would make a good hero with his tragic past.If any ff7 character is underrated, its cid highwind, and hojo.

    Toppoz doesn't care for ff6, and i have seen videos of people who hate squall with a passion.Spoony hates everything about FFX, and i find it to be irrational.Maybe i am too, but some people share my hatred of the card queen, and elleone, some hate ff7 as well.

    I find FFXII characters far more enjoyable than FFXIII, with female cloud, and crybaby hope, and annoying selphie clone named vanille, who was far far less annoying than the others.Something about hope reminds me of raiden in the metal gear solid series, but i don't like raiden.

  17. #17
    Just a normal dude... AFMG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nostalgia gamer View Post
    Dear AFMG:
    Some peopl hate specific characters.I can't stand Cloud because of his personality, and ill gotten fame by cult fanboys.Sephiroth, because:In my opinion, he would make a good hero with his tragic past.If any ff7 character is underrated, its cid highwind, and hojo.
    I think they weren't THAT bad to begin with, but as I told earlier, they weren't as well developed as other FF characters in past games: Cloud has something going on, but ends up as a blank slate. Sephirot had the chance to be more complex, but being the villain, had to succumb to the insane plot. The worst thing is the fandom that spawned from those characters and then the "re-work" Square Enix did to those characters because of the fandom.

  18. #18
    Grand Shriner
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    Quote Originally Posted by AFMG View Post
    I think they weren't THAT bad to begin with, but as I told earlier, they weren't as well developed as other FF characters in past games: Cloud has something going on, but ends up as a blank slate. Sephirot had the chance to be more complex, but being the villain, had to succumb to the insane plot. The worst thing is the fandom that spawned from those characters and then the "re-work" Square Enix did to those characters because of the fandom.
    Cloud acted like an ass, and felt sorry for himself.His and sephiroth fanboys/girls, add a new level of annoyance amongst mixed genres, and that says a lot.There are people, like me, who think it is somewhere on the top 10 most overrated games of all time.For me, the fifa soccer games are there too.Anyways, the reaction to said fanbase and game says a lot.The bigger the reaction, the bigger deal it becomes, because it means that a lot of gamers are disatisfied.

  19. #19
    Onion Kid
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    Quote Originally Posted by AFMG View Post
    ...(like Pitchfork at Socksmakespeoplesexy)...
    Thanks for referring this guy to us. I had never heard of this reviewer or read his reviews but they're very good. I really like them.

  20. #20
    Just a normal dude... AFMG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olde View Post
    Thanks for referring this guy to us. I had never heard of this reviewer or read his reviews but they're very good. I really like them.
    There are lot of reviews there that are very well crafted and well-balanced. It's one of my favorite sites. The whole review for the Final Fantasy saga is worth a reading.

  21. #21
    Grand Shriner FF7genie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olde View Post
    Seconded.

    By the way, FF7genie, if you were 9 years old when Final Fantasy 7 came out and posted this atrocious message in 2012, that means you're 24 years old and writing like an eight-year-old. Please proof-read your posts, and don't include god-awful poor writing that makes it difficult to figure out what you're saying, especially if your point is just, "I was young, you were old, I got it, you didn't."





    i didnt sign up on the forum to impress anybody with my grammer...i didnt master my keyboard yet..however i did master my sticks...im not here to go through everydamn word i type an make sure its spelled correctly for you, i didn't ask you to waste 10 minutes of you're life to read my post about why most people didn't like ff7..so why did you have too go an try to insult me? what was the point...oo let me guess its probably because i only have 70 posts right compared to you're 70,000? that u have to try an be a smart ass no it all mr. im so good at typing on my keyboard......it's funny that 2 people had something to say about my grammer...ur not me dudes, don't worry about the way i type, if it really bothers you....don't read it, and if you do read it....how about you dont be an inconsiderate piece of dung and try to make fun of people about it....my guess is, this is more then likely one of many times u guys insulted someone about there grammer.....don't be a jerk about it..if u knew me in real life i'd make you shit in you're panties. thank you have a nice day, follow up with something a little bit more considerate next time...u never know what u might run into when u go outside.
    \
    Last edited by FF7genie; 08-20-2012 at 03:21 AM.

  22. #22
    Heal the body, heal the heart... Enkidoh's Avatar
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    Okay, that's enough FF7Genie. Although I disagree with members flaming each other, on this site we try to maintain a fairly decent standard of grammar and syntax - even if you're using a smartphone/portable device, it is no excuse for a level of grammar in your post that is the equivalent of a five year old. Your previous post was indeed a pain to read, and Olde, Revan and Nostalgia Gamer were quite right in being critical about it.

    However, I do not agree with members attacking each other, so guys and ladies, there is to be no more flaming - as this thread has been derailed enough as it is. I really don't want to start banning people and having to lock/delete this thread, but I will if this sort of petty behavior continues. Remember, play nice!
    enkffxisig-new-small

  23. #23
    Grand Shriner FF7genie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enkidoh View Post
    Okay, that's enough FF7Genie. Although I disagree with members flaming each other, on this site we try to maintain a fairly decent standard of grammar and syntax - even if you're using a smartphone/portable device, it is no excuse for a level of grammar in your post that is the equivalent of a five year old. Your previous post was indeed a pain to read, and Olde, Revan and Nostalgia Gamer were quite right in being critical about it.

    However, I do not agree with members attacking each other, so guys and ladies, there is to be no more flaming - as this thread has been derailed enough as it is. I really don't want to start banning people and having to lock/delete this thread, but I will if this sort of petty behavior continues. Remember, play nice!
    sorry man...it just tics me off when some people think there better then others..........wont happen again, i usually dont do that unless im attacked first wich in this case i was....all i was asking is for them to be a little more considerate. Hey genie, do you think maybe you could check over you're post next time? thank you..... thats all it takes, didnt have to be ignorant about it.....

  24. #24
    Grand Shriner
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    Quote Originally Posted by FF7genie View Post
    sorry man...it just tics me off when some people think there better then others..........wont happen again, i usually dont do that unless im attacked first wich in this case i was....all i was asking is for them to be a little more considerate. Hey genie, do you think maybe you could check over you're post next time? thank you..... thats all it takes, didnt have to be ignorant about it.....
    I never attacked you, i only kindly pointed out a few things.I prefer not to fight.Insulting won't get your opinion through, just cause trouble.It is the strategy of a person who doesn't know how to create valid points.

    I still disagree with you. agree to disagree?

  25. #25
    Yayhaaa HappyBoomstick's Avatar
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    I liked the change in villains in FF7. I think that allowed the game to be played in a sort of 'arc' type structure. You finish the Shinra Opression Arc and then move onto, well, saving the damn world from Sephiroth and Meteor. I can't make comments on some of the other things because I truly never took Final Fantasy 7's story as seriously as I probably should have. It was a fantastic game for sure but the only reason I liked it was because of the fantastic set pieces, the music and the characters personalities and designs.

    The story took a back seat for me in 7. It was a pretty simple story at that, when looked at from a wider point of view. But there is one thing I can comment on - I think Sephiroth was meant to be surrounded in mystery and suspense. His thought processes were largely unknown for a lot of the game, whilst Clouds character was more developed, that way we're more attached to Cloud than Sephiroth. I think some girls are more attached to Sephiroth but I digress.

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