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Kabraxis
10-02-2006, 11:10 PM
(Could a mod please delete the first copy of the thread which i accidently posted without a title? Thanks and sorry!)

You may find the title of the thread strange, well it means what it says. Someone like Sephiroth could be the answer to some of out long term problems here on Earth.

As most of you have hopefull noticed, people, unlike other organisms, consume faster than the source can be replenished, because we are smart enough to develop the technologies needed to do so.

So smart yet lacking the knowledge to control these smarts. Essentially dooming ourselves.

Not to sound like some raving hippie, but a realist rather, take a look. As the human population increases we need to make more of everything to account for the people and make sure people are living comfortably. In doing so urbanize more and more of the earth, including places essential to the carbon dioxide to oxygen conversion such as the rainforests. We also consume oil (mostly 1st world countries) at an exponentially increasing rate, and face the end of the oil reservoirs in the earth.

In addition to that we've created a hole in the ozone layer and the ocean levels are rising as, popularly, an effect of global warming due to our placing filth into the atmosphere while we consume the earth.

One of the biggest problems causing this is the overpopulation of humans. We consume so much that the planet cannot handle such high numbers of us. For example, in the last 55 years about, China's population has more than doubled and India's has more than tripled. That is a very significant increase, and while rates in India are increasing even more, china has the right idea and is trying to hinder the population explosion with the one child law, however that is backfiring, which is irrelevent to the topic. Anyways, those are the two largest individual cases, but overal the world population has increased from about 2.5 billion to 6.5 billion in the last 55 years, and given the amount of time people have been around, that is a huge increase in a short amount of time.

So, what are we doing in response to the massivly increasing population that will cause doom to the world in time? Well we have people protesting abortion, heaven forbid a human, with less cognitive ability than the chickens most people eat, dies. We also have people looking to cure diseases like cancer and AIDS which, horrible as it sounds, are helping to keep the population in check. We have peopel looking to stop wars, which i'll also coldly say, reduce the population. We're trying to make people live longer with medecines, so that they will be alive longer consuming.

Heart disease is the leading cause of death in the U.S., and we are looking to cure that and all other organ failures by growing new ones with stem cells.

Natural selection keeps most populations in check but humans are smart enough to pretty much eliminate it. People who cant move their limbs get a super chair and a little dog slave, people with poor vision get glasses, and people without common sense are saved by warning labels. People with dead minds, like Terri Shaivo, even consume resources because people think that even pointless life is so precious that it's necessary to keep her body functional as long as possible, even if it's not doing anything.

All of this horrible destruction is due to a concept I like to call immature hedonism. Hedonists, as anyone with a psychological backround will know, are people who, by definition, do what brings them pleasure. The concept is under debate. How i see it; everyone is completely hedonistic and does what brings them pleasure. Someone who skips class to go smoke a bowl does it because that brings them pleasure, while someone who goes to class and takes notes gets the pleasure of knowing they will do well on the test. Both are hedonistic, but the difference is immature and mature hedonism. The immature hedonist gets pleasure by instant gratification, like someone who eats lots of sugar and fat; the mature hedonist gets pleasure by knowing their actions will be better for the long run, liek the person who goes to class or someone who eats healthy things that taste bad.

All this money goes to keeping people alive and making people live longer. I've always thought we should switch it over to research and create the technology to travel to and inhabit another planet, before this one's time is up.

So, back to Sephiroth; wanting to use earth as a vessel to a new planet is closer to a logical ideal than anyone with power on earth has come up with as far as solving long term problems, because on the short term, yay we're living longer, but on the long term, the imminent doom of the human race and the planet draws closer because of our immature hedonistic consumption.

So yeah, if sephiroth were a bit more friendly and willing to collaborate a bit to perfect his ideas, he'd be a damn cool guy to have running things, for the sake of the greater good.

Prak
10-03-2006, 07:17 AM
You hippie.

Denny
10-03-2006, 07:23 AM
I didn`t read it!. :D

Mr Jack
10-03-2006, 07:36 AM
You hippie.

lol

The Lost One
10-03-2006, 08:04 AM
Sephiroth would be good for one thing... To bring black capes back into fashion, and make long grey hair look cool.

Mr Jack
10-03-2006, 10:10 AM
amen

Kabraxis
10-03-2006, 10:11 AM
You hippie.

Hippies want to stop war... and liek cure disease and make everyone happy.

Also, i dont have long hair, nor do i smoke pot and ride a long board around and wear hemp accessories.

And Lost One, the cape and hair were a given. More fringe benefits.

jewess crabcake
10-03-2006, 10:14 AM
1) tl;dr
2) I would trade sephiroth for your meaningless life in a heartbeat

Kabraxis
10-03-2006, 10:43 AM
Well i'm new to this forum, but i guess i have to learn somehow that people here are too ADD to read more than a 2 line post and incapable of intelligent discussion...

Thanks for teaching me!

edit>And is there some trick to getting a sig to work here? How come it shows up randomly and not on all posts?

Redbat
10-03-2006, 10:52 AM
THAT SONDS PRETTY COOL BUT I AM A LVL. 89 AND HAVE OMNISLASH SO I WOULD JUST BE ABLE TO KILL HIM ANYWAY.

NorseFTX
10-03-2006, 11:17 AM
Wow....
That's a very interesting societal analysis!
=] I've thought about these things too....

Even so, I'm still in the field of medicine....

I think there are better ways to population control than killing people >>
Thought that IS the fastest way....

I think that the number of children people have should be reduced or something instead....because I think that once someone is born into this world...they have the right to fight for their lives. We just shouldn't bring more people into the world when we can't accomodate them....it wouldn't be fair to both them and all the others already living....

<< It might just be my excuse for the fact that I don't really want to marry some guy and have....children with him, but that's what I think.

Hex Omega
10-03-2006, 01:18 PM
Yes, and replicators would be great, so would transporters, and a great big Stargate.

Fail.

Calgar
10-03-2006, 01:37 PM
Could not be bothered to read that. It would never solve any problems on earth.

jewess crabcake
10-03-2006, 02:57 PM
Well i'm new to this forum, but i guess i have to learn somehow that people here are too ADD to read more than a 2 line post and incapable of intelligent discussion...

Thanks for teaching me!

edit>And is there some trick to getting a sig to work here? How come it shows up randomly and not on all posts?1) ADD is a noun not an adjective I cannot be ADD because mental disease can't talk or type.
2) To have an intelligent discussion, you would need a intelligent topic.


(Could a mod please delete the first copy of the thread which i accidently posted without a title? Thanks and sorry!)

You may find the title of the thread strange, well it means what it says. Someone like Sephiroth could be the answer to some of out long term problems here on Earth.

As most of you have hopefull noticed, people, unlike other organisms, consume resources faster than the resources can be replenished, because we are smart enough to develop the technologies needed to do so.

<strike>So smart yet lacking the knowledge to control these smarts. Essentially dooming ourselves.</strike>We are intelligent, yet lack the control of of our destructive habits.

Not to sound like some raving hippie, but a realist rather, take a look. As the human population increases we need to make more of everything to account for the people and make sure people are living comfortably. In doing so urbanize more and more of the earth, including places essential to the carbon dioxide to oxygen conversion such as the rainforests. We also consume oil (mostly 1st world countries) at an exponentially increasing rate, and face the end of the oil reservoirs in the earth.

In addition to that we've created a hole in the ozone layer and the ocean levels are rising as, popularly, an effect of global warming due to our placing filth into the atmosphere while we consume the earth.

One of the biggest problems causing this is the overpopulation of humans. We consume so much that the planet cannot handle such high numbers of us. For example, in the last 55 years about, China's population has more than doubled and India's has more than tripled. That is a very significant increase, and while rates in India are increasing even more, china has the right idea and is trying to hinder the population explosion with the one child law, however that is backfiring, which is irrelevent to the topic. Anyways, those are the two largest individual cases, but overall the world population has increased from about 2.5 billion to 6.5 billion in the last 55 years, and given the amount of time people have been around, that is a huge increase in a short amount of time.

So, what are we doing in response to the massivly increasing population that will cause doom to the world in time? Well we have people protesting abortion, heaven forbid a human, with less cognitive ability than the chickens most people eat, dies. We also have people looking to cure diseases like cancer and AIDS which, horrible as it sounds, are helping to keep the population in check. We have people looking to stop wars, which i'll also coldly say, reduce the population. We're trying to make people live longer with medecines, so that they will be alive longer consuming.

Heart disease is the leading cause of death in the U.S., and we are looking to cure that and all other organ failures by growing new ones with stem cells.

Natural selection keeps most populations in check but humans are smart enough to pretty much eliminate it. People who cant move their limbs get a super chair and a little dog slave, people with poor vision get glasses, and people without common sense are saved by warning labels. People with dead minds, like Terri Shaivo, even consume resources because people think that even pointless life is so precious that it's necessary to keep her body functional as long as possible, even if it's not doing anything.

All of this horrible destruction is due to a concept I like to call immature hedonism. Hedonists, as anyone with a psychological backround will know, are people who, by definition, do what brings them pleasure. The concept is under debate. How i see it; everyone is completely hedonistic and does what brings them pleasure. Someone who skips class to go smoke a bowl does it because that brings them pleasure, while someone who goes to class and takes notes gets the pleasure of knowing they will do well on the test. Both are hedonistic, but the difference is immature and mature hedonism. The immature hedonist gets pleasure by instant gratification, like someone who eats lots of sugar and fat; the mature hedonist gets pleasure by knowing their actions will be better for the long run, like the person who goes to class or someone who eats healthy things that taste bad.

All this money goes to keeping people alive and making people live longer. I've always thought we should switch it over to research and create the technology to travel to and inhabit another planet, before this one's time is up.

So, back to Sephiroth; wanting to use earth as a vessel to a new planet is closer to a logical ideal than anyone with power on earth has come up with as far as solving long term problems, because on the short term, yay we're living longer, but on the long term, the imminent doom of the human race and the planet draws closer because of our immature hedonistic consumption.

So yeah, if sephiroth were a bit more friendly and willing to collaborate a bit to perfect his ideas, he'd be a damn cool guy to have running things, for the sake of the greater good.
What are you retarded? That was a hypothetic question. Now on to the maniacal ranting fest. So it is in your belief that instead of recycling and moderating the atmospheric toxins let's just kill those S.O.B.'s with omniszlash cLOOD and ZEPHIroth. Instead of trying to be a humanitarian, and aid those who have been dealed a bad hand, should just be fucked off, I mean why keep those who are going to die eventually alive right. Ok so to you keepingourselves in the dark age would ultimately save humanity? Go back to amish land you 18th century hippie bitch. OMFG this guy just said juck off the retards what next the jews? The gypsies? anyonw w/o blonde hair and blue eyes? I'd go on but reading your ultimate maniacal postsis decreasing my IQ. BUt good luck rising the Nazis to listen to tEh Kewl BlAdse weildER Zephiroth.

Kabraxis
10-03-2006, 04:13 PM
Finally some reasonable argument.

The problem with recycling and moderating air polutants and the like is that we dont do it fast enough to keep up with the growth of the population, as can be seen. Yes, some things are looking good like hydrogen fuel cell cars and such, but some things are looking idiotic like the fact that it pollutes the air more to recycle a soda can than it does to make a new one. (i'm not sure where the numbers fall with other recycleable materials.

First you called me a hippie (even tho i'm supporting war) then you called me a Nazi (even tho i haven't expressed a problem toward any particular race or sexuality). The lone fact that you called me both doesn't make sense but that you called me both with no merit, is just plain foolish.

Now, about these retards... I feel sorry for them, really I do, it's not fair that they were born retarded but what can we do about that? I mean, most people who eat cows and birds and such don't have a problem with that because they are "lower life forms" who cant communicate with us and such. But it's not fair that they were born a cow just the same as it's not fair some kid's born a retard. Yet people seem to think the kid should lead a spoiled life just because it's human. Meercats are smarter than that, they kill some of their babies if they know that there are too many to take care of.

And with really disabled people, i'm just saying, it's a downside of outsmarting natural selection that they continue to live and consume.

I mean, if you look at some other species, like a moose for random example. They haven't outsmarted natural selection. Mooses with deformed legs get left behind and eaten by wolves up in the Canadian tundra there. But at the same time, moose aren't going to be the cause of the death of the earth.

Oh and before you get to overexcited about the whoel sephiroth part, know that i just tacked that onto the beginning and end of my thoughts so that it could apply to the final fantasy forums. I wanted to make a thought provoking post that would bring about some good discussion for that contest that's going on, and had to apply it to final fantasy somehow...

NorseFTX
10-03-2006, 04:28 PM
There must be a reason humans are capable of compassion and these things....
We've been given the opportunity to step outside of natural selection, and help those that aren't as fortunate, who normally wouldn't be able to survive....

What does that mean...?
For our role as "humanity", I mean....

jewess crabcake
10-03-2006, 04:34 PM
You would have many more responses if you lost the Sephiroth part.

The problem with recycling and moderating air polutants and the like is that we dont do it fast enough to keep up with the growth of the population, as can be seen. Yes, some things are looking good like hydrogen fuel cell cars and such, but some things are looking idiotic like the fact that it pollutes the air more to recycle a soda can than it does to make a new one. (i'm not sure where the numbers fall with other recycleable materials. Yes but moderating births can be downside, what if a plethera of scientistis found a way to decrease input of pollutanis in the air and increase landmass, yes speaking this is a huge statement without any source of logic. You cannot deem someones life wasteable before they've even lived it, what if MLKjr. mom had an abortion the world, well the US mostly, would be completely different. What if you just screwed someone out of true love, what if you stopped a mass murderer, which you for some reason think to be good people. Every life affects the world ,you don't think so but it does, if somebody's in a good mood and decides to help someone, someone else will see that and think I should help someone else too. Society is just one big "chain of causation".

First you called me a hippie (even tho i'm supporting war) then you called me a Nazi (even tho i haven't expressed a problem toward any particular race or sexuality). The lone fact that you called me both doesn't make sense but that you called me both with no merit, is just plain foolish.I called you a lot of things, amish, Nazi, hippie, and a fanboy:rolleyes:. Insults don't have to correlate, please don't take these personally, it just takes the fun out if you do.
Now, about these retards... I feel sorry for them, really I do, it's not fair that they were born retarded but what can we do about that? I mean, most people who eat cows and birds and such don't have a problem with that because they are "lower life forms" who cant communicate with us and such. But it's not fair that they were born a cow just the same as it's not fair some kid's born a retard. Yet people seem to think the kid should lead a spoiled life just because it's human. Meer cats are smarter than that, they kill some of their babies if they know that there are too many to take care of.Human society is nothing like the jungle or the food chain, humans have the power to will moral and immoral, humans show compassion which is in my opinion our gift and curse. No bcause they are under us on the food chain, they don't serve a lot more purposes than food and compost, and this cow didn't have a god give right to life, if you take god out of the mix of life, you will think that humans are nothing less than animals. If you have cows as parents, it is inevitable that you will be a cow. It is only fair a human should live as a human not just be killed of because they are "worthless". Once again comparing people to animals is not smart, we think differently than they do we think action and consequence they just think action.
And with really disabled people, i'm just saying, it's a downside of outsmarting natural selection that they continue to live and consume.Who are we to deny a human life?
I mean, if you look at some other species, like a moose for random example. They haven't outsmarted natural selection. Mooses with deformed legs get left behind and eaten by wolves up in the Canadian tundra there. But at the same time, moose aren't going to be the cause of the death of the earth.That is the food chain most likely that wolf was going to get him in the first place.
Oh and before you get to overexcited about the whoel sephiroth part, know that i just tacked that onto the beginning and end of my thoughts so that it could apply to the final fantasy forums. I wanted to make a thought provoking post that would bring about some good discussion for that contest that's going on, and had to apply it to final fantasy somehow...hmm I see.

Kabraxis
10-03-2006, 08:30 PM
Yes but moderating births can be downside, what if a plethera of scientistis found a way to decrease input of pollutanis in the air and increase landmass, yes speaking this is a huge statement without any source of logic. You cannot deem someones life wasteable before they've even lived it, what if MLKjr. mom had an abortion the world, well the US mostly, would be completely different. What if you just screwed someone out of true love, what if you stopped a mass murderer, which you for some reason think to be good people. Every life affects the world ,you don't think so but it does, if somebody's in a good mood and decides to help someone, someone else will see that and think I should help someone else too. Society is just one big "chain of causation".

"What if". In many cases, including this one, they can go both ways easily. I could say what if Hitlers mom had had an abortion or what if Timothy McVeigh's mom had an abortion. We really wont get anywhere going back and forth with those.


Human society is nothing like the jungle or the food chain, humans have the power to will moral and immoral, humans show compassion which is in my opinion our gift and curse. No bcause they are under us on the food chain, they don't serve a lot more purposes than food and compost, and this cow didn't have a god give right to life, if you take god out of the mix of life, you will think that humans are nothing less than animals. If you have cows as parents, it is inevitable that you will be a cow. It is only fair a human should live as a human not just be killed of because they are "worthless". Once again comparing people to animals is not smart, we think differently than they do we think action and consequence they just think action.

Firstly, i'm an Atheist and since god cant be proven (we could have a whole seperate argument) I dont think it shows anything...
See with this quote it shows you are thinking about the animals only in relation to you: "they don't serve a lot more purposes than food and compost" which i find to be a selfish point of view. The cow shows pain while it's being slaughtered and clearly has a different view on its life than you do, but you only consider your view. Selfish.

The gift and curse thing is right on. The gift part of it is the short term, the curse part of it is the long term.

Consider this: people are sometimes born with mental abnormalities which cause them to be more likely to break laws and comit sometimes very serious crimes; they get thrown in prison regardless. In my opinion a long prison sentence is worse than death. But the point is the punishment they get for something they cant help. Most people dont turn their head to this but when it comes to the point of death, people get so uptight. Lots of people are all against the death penalty and think people sohuld get just life in prison? What's the difference?? Oh, one consumes resources.

And also, you are wrong about what you think are the differences between a human and animal mind. Animals think consequence and action as we do, jsut not as logically. If you have one of those mean shock collars on a dog that shocks it when it barks, it's going to eventually think "i'm not going to bark because i'll get shocked", which is thinking about consequences. Animal brains work the same way, they just dont develope as far. For example, an average adult pig has a brain nearly equal to that of an average 3 year old human.


Who are we to deny a human life?
Who are we to deny anything's life if you are going to bring it to that? Of all things i find it most logical to deny a human life because humans are the problem, not moose.


That is the food chain most likely that wolf was going to get him in the first place.

You have to consider natural selection with the food chain. All moose aren't going to get wolved. The weak are, that's how natural selection works, the weak die and the strong live and reproduce. This in turn makes evolution work because the strongest and most fit to survive reproduce and over generations the species gets stronger, none of the weak blood pollutes the gene pool because the wolves take care of those.

Mr Jack
10-04-2006, 04:59 AM
hmmm - i agree

Magneto42
10-04-2006, 07:00 AM
Hmm. If any charcter should be on earth it should be Seifer. He would kill you, you damn hippy.

Mr Jack
10-04-2006, 07:22 AM
seifer sucks....

phoeix_reborn
10-04-2006, 08:30 AM
There must be a reason humans are capable of compassion and these things....
We've been given the opportunity to step outside of natural selection, and help those that aren't as fortunate, who normally wouldn't be able to survive....

What does that mean...?
For our role as "humanity", I mean....

humans are simply evolving, boredom is the one reason we are capable of developing anything, other animals don't experience it. As for other human emotions they are all effectively for preolonged survival.

Humans will find it difficult to do kabraxis because they are currently doing what we are born to do, survive. The more of us there are the more chance we have of surviving/pro creating therefore we continue to do so.

and just a thought but haven't we already damaged this planet irreparably? im not sure we have, sum1 please say as i cannot check this up myself.

jewess crabcake
10-04-2006, 09:58 AM
See with this quote it shows you are thinking about the animals only in relation to you: "they don't serve a lot more purposes than food and compost" which i find to be a selfish point of view. The cow shows pain while it's being slaughtered and clearly has a different view on its life than you do, but you only consider your view. Selfish.How is it sefish we all need a healthy diet of animals annd plants why should I be malnutritioned for an animal that if in the wild would be eaten by some other animal. What did you expect of course the cow would be eaten, iif not bby us then it would be eaten alive by another animal, and actually if the sever the head from behind the neck damaging the spinal cord it can be quick and painless.
Consider this: people are sometimes born with mental abnormalities which cause them to be more likely to break laws and comit sometimes very serious crimes; they get thrown in prison regardless. In my opinion a long prison sentence is worse than death. But the point is the punishment they get for something they cant help. Most people dont turn their head to this but when it comes to the point of death, people get so uptight. Lots of people are all against the death penalty and think people sohuld get just life in prison? What's the difference?? Oh, one consumes resources.Actually I'm against life in prison I believe they should pay for their crimes, but the gverment has no control over life, but I'm not getting into capital punishment.
You have to consider natural selection with the food chain. All moose aren't going to get wolved. The weak are, that's how natural selection works, the weak die and the strong live and reproduce. This in turn makes evolution work because the strongest and most fit to survive reproduce and over generations the species gets stronger, none of the weak blood pollutes the gene pool because the wolves take care of those.We are further progressed than animals, we no longr have to live by these rules, we are social selfless creatures who feel compassion for our fellow man.

Kabraxis
10-04-2006, 10:02 AM
Humans are strange though because we are actually not evolving, we are making the world around us evolve. We, physically, haven't been changing significantly. As per natural selection we've also outsmarted evolution in that we don't change, we make other things change. We make technologies that make life easier instead of physically changing to be better. We produce heated places to live so we don't have to adapt to the cold, or vice versa.


Humans will find it difficult to do kabraxis because they are currently doing what we are born to do, survive. The more of us there are the more chance we have of surviving/pro creating therefore we continue to do so.

With any other animal i would agree with that, but with humans, we are smart enough to realize that we don't need to keep creating such an excessive amount of people. We're not quite endangered if you hadn't noticed.


and just a thought but haven't we already damaged this planet irreparably? im not sure we have, sum1 please say as i cannot check this up myself.

There is a hole in the ozone above Australia (easy to get skin cancer there) which we dont know how to fix, and also, while it can't be proven, all evidence points toward that global warming is going on. Also while i guess it isn't irrepairable we've bulldozed a ton of the rainforests and built condominiums instead, so it would be difficult to repair.

Desert Wolf
10-04-2006, 10:04 AM
So what your saying here is that as the population of the world increases we should let the strong live and the weak die? Who decides who is fit to live? You? Saying that people who are disabled should be classed as weak and are not fit to live is rubbish, unless you would consider Stephen Hawkings a weak and invaluable person.


This is interesting:


even tho i'm supporting war
Can you explain why you support murder which is what war is and then say

Who are we to deny anything's life

Prak
10-04-2006, 10:17 AM
Hey hippie kid. Global warming is bullshit that only gets spewed to fulfill political agendas. The earth goes through natural cycles of heating and cooling. It was just as hot as it now a couple hundred years ago. It cooled off then and it'll cool off again.

Kabraxis
10-04-2006, 12:09 PM
Lionheart we dont need a diet of plants and animals. Animals get their nutrients from what they eat, which eventualy, even if they eat other animals, comes from plants. 80 years ago i would not feel this way, but with the technology we have today to get whatever we need, we actually dont need to eat animals to be healthy. You can lead a perfectly healthy life with everything you need from noin-meat products at your local grocery store, wehreas in the past when people were like on the fronteir they couldn't get the protien and vitamin B12 they needed unless they killed some cows or hunted some elk.


We are further progressed than animals, we no longr have to live by these rules, we are social selfless creatures who feel compassion for our fellow man.

This is true, i'm jsut saying it's unfortunate that we're dooming ourselves and the planet because we can't moderate how we take advantage of this lack of rules.


So what your saying here is that as the population of the world increases we should let the strong live and the weak die? Who decides who is fit to live? You? Saying that people who are disabled should be classed as weak and are not fit to live is rubbish, unless you would consider Stephen Hawkings a weak and invaluable person.

I'm saying its kind of sad how that since the weak and the stong live, everything is doomed.

And i said who are we to deny any life in resonse to lionheart saying who are we to deny a person's life. In my opinion it makes the most sense to deny a human life because they are the problem.

NorseFTX
10-04-2006, 02:27 PM
Humans are strange though because we are actually not evolving, we are making the world around us evolve. We, physically, haven't been changing significantly. As per natural selection we've also outsmarted evolution in that we don't change, we make other things change. We make technologies that make life easier instead of physically changing to be better. We produce heated places to live so we don't have to adapt to the cold, or vice versa.

Mmhm--that's true...! I've never thought of it that way before....
=) But it also is true that we just haven't had much time to evolve--

A human generation is about 20 years or so, right?
So it's 5 generations a century....
We've been farming since 10,000 years ago, approximately....so that's 500 generations.

A bacterial generation is about 20 minutes...
That's 70 generations a day...
And that should be about 500 generations a week....

So bacteria have had as much time to evolve in a week as we did ever since farming and agriculture began....
>.>
We're still work-in-progress!

Kabraxis
10-04-2006, 03:44 PM
Good points, however do you logically see us evolving? It goes hand in hand with natural selection, and if the strong are not the only ones surviving, the whole gene pool cant just go in a strong direction. From a logical standpoint, people in 3rd world countries where the strong are much more likely to survive, should evolve into a more superior race than those of us in america or japan or western europe.

However i think the sheer number of people will kill off the planet before that has the time to happen.

Swedish Fish
10-04-2006, 04:43 PM
How does being vegetarian or evolution have the slightest thing to do with Sephiroth?

Kabraxis
10-04-2006, 05:12 PM
Either you didn't read the whoel thread or you aren't very observant...

Swedish Fish
10-04-2006, 05:16 PM
Sorry, my allergy to bullshit was getting bad and I had to get out of the Thread before I could read a lot of it.

NorseFTX
10-04-2006, 05:36 PM
They are related to Sephiroth! >>
We were talking about overpopulation and overexploitation of resources....
So then it'd be good that Sephiroth was here--he could help...um...control population!

Then we talked about how ethical it was to control population the way Sephiroth would....>>
And then we started talking about natural selection and the way people help others that normally wouldn't survive, which is partially the reason why there is a lot of population.
After talking about natural selection, we started talking about evolution! So that's how we got to where we were. =]

Andyuk
10-04-2006, 05:49 PM
However i think the sheer number of people will kill off the planet before that has the time to happen.

I think the planet is going to be fine. Maybe it will become inhabitable by humans or most other life, but if all life ends, it isn't the end of the world as such.

Please explain how killing humans is a good thing?

I say that if the planet does get overpopulated then people will start dying out and maybe will kickstart a global pregnancy curbing program (or start wars to gain control of resources)

Kabraxis
10-04-2006, 11:13 PM
Well as population goes up so does famine, urban crowding, pollution, nuclear waste, deforestation, poverty, and any other social ill you can come up with.

As urbanization goes up the air we breathe gets worse because of pollution and because to urbanize we need to destroy forests which bring us oxygen.

I gues you're right that the world wont like crack in half and fall apart... but if all life ends... that kinda goes along with what i'm getting at..

jewess crabcake
10-05-2006, 09:42 AM
Lionheart we dont need a diet of plants and animals. Animals get their nutrients from what they eat, which eventualy, even if they eat other animals, comes from plants. 80 years ago i would not feel this way, but with the technology we have today to get whatever we need, we actually dont need to eat animals to be healthy. You can lead a perfectly healthy life with everything you need from noin-meat products at your local grocery store, wehreas in the past when people were like on the fronteir they couldn't get the protien and vitamin B12 they needed unless they killed some cows or hunted some elk.
So basically the food pyramid is a liar? There are proteins that animals have that we need, like iron, to get strong muscles, you don't want to be a whiny little string bean hippy do you? Systematically killing people or randomly killing people wouldn't solve anything because, one you wouldn't b able to kill as man people as necessary, two who would go about killing about 1 billion+ people, and finally it is a dumb idea the population would just grow back.

Prak
10-05-2006, 09:58 AM
you don't want to be a whiny little string bean hippy do you?

I roffled.

phoeix_reborn
10-05-2006, 11:15 AM
Please explain how killing humans is a good thing?

well....humans are possibly the most foolish creatures, we are intelligent and capable of using tools, these tools produced advanced tools and now we can make almost anything, but therein lies the problem, no one really understands what we are doing. Humans are effectively like a parasite, we take a lot and give back a little, however we then take back what we gave with a lot more besides, we are slowly destroying the planet. Nature has of course been fighting back (weve been helping it to) with multiple viruses e.g. AIDS something which should have been stopped at its root but was simply evolved because of us.

I agree that we need to cut down but as we expand it appears that we are going to be cut down by viruses or ultimately eachother.

as for the whole of life being wiped out on this planet not killing the planet. It'll become an empty shell for a long time. But then some deep sea creatures will evolve to rise in the ocean, they will ultimately evolve and restart the cycle.

In fact all this seems pretty pointless considering how small and short lived we are, i hate humans, sorry...

NorseFTX
10-05-2006, 11:40 AM
Even if someone did decide to kill people...>>
How would they decide on who should die...? =(
Even if people were horribly low and disgusting and everything, I still think that they should have the right to live their lives to the end...they might actually be capable of great things, and if we kill them at that point, the world will never see it....

Kabraxis
10-06-2006, 12:43 AM
So basically the food pyramid is a liar? There are proteins that animals have that we need, like iron, to get strong muscles, you don't want to be a whiny little string bean hippy do you? Systematically killing people or randomly killing people wouldn't solve anything because, one you wouldn't b able to kill as man people as necessary, two who would go about killing about 1 billion+ people, and finally it is a dumb idea the population would just grow back.

The food pyramid is nothing but a way to safely be healthy without restricting your food choices. Believe it or not, it is not the only healthy eating plan. As i said, because of the technology we have today, we dont need to go to the lengths we once needed to to get the nutrition we need. For example: one of the biggest reasons the dairy section is there is for calcium, you know, strong bones. Well nowadays you can buy a 20oz. bottle of Minute Maid orange juice that's added 66% of your daily calcium.

Also, strong muscles are aquired through eating protien after fatiguing them and causing the release of lactic acid. Most of the iron in meat comes from blood in the meat. But iron is also an easy thing to get, heck, strawberries are rich in iron.

There are lots of very good athletes, including some olympic ones, who are vegetarian because if you put in that extra effort to get the nutrition you need without meats, its much better for you in the long run, especially when it comes to cardiovascular health. Vegetarians have a 75% less chance of developing heart disease, which is the leading cause of death in America. It just takes more effort, but that all kinda goes back to the immature/mature hedonism thing.

Phoeix reborn... rockin.

Archaeans, a type of prokaryotic unicellular organism, would likely be the last things living. They are the types of things you find living in extreme conditions such as super hot thermal geysers and super salty areas where nothing else can live. They would probably evolve, probably into some damn tough shit too.

If we were to kill people...

I'd start with serious criminals. The ones who just get a bunch of years in prison, like rapists. What a waste of money and resources and time. Not only would it take care of them, but it would reduce crime if people knew the punishment that was at stake.

The Terri Shaivos of the world next... agian.. a waste of money. Why on earth would you want to keep a mindless body alive when it is consuming?

The seriously mentally retarded... come on. People kill dolphins that are far smarted than these people when they go tuna fishing. What is the problem? Just because they are a human life?

As far as quadrapolegics and such, i wouldn't say kill them... I say in a population with working natural selection, they should be dead, but we have no natural selection, and if we need one thing to improve the world, its brainpower, which at least these folks are capable of.

heh, controversy :P

Darkiss
10-08-2006, 06:49 PM
U see the whole things of it's practical-logical side...

Not that sentimental...

Being honest some serious criminals such as serial killers or chidren-rapists really ain't worth living...In my opinion...But I didn't give them life so I can't remove it.

And there are some ppl with serious health problems but also with a brilliant mind(Tom Hawkins is an example<-I'm not so sure of how to write his name)

Andyuk
10-08-2006, 07:13 PM
It's sad how quickly you would look to culling of human life to solve a problem that is nothing but a theory at the current time.

It would be a lot more usefull to make the criminals plant trees or something.

Also about the forests. We get most of our oxygen from algae in the sea.

cutting down trees does not add to 'pollution' all that much. The problem there is the animals have nowhere to live and it messes with the local environment.

IDX
10-08-2006, 09:25 PM
This is a 'just to let you know' statement: cannibals are one of the most healthiest people. The nutrition that a human body needs is obviously in the human body, which is consumed by the cannibal which means that he/she is only dependant on eating humans because the nutrition is there.

FTR, I'm not a cannibal.

Kabraxis
10-08-2006, 09:26 PM
I'm glad i'm not of the popular mindset that human life is so hideously important just because it is the same species as myself. Especailly humans that rape kids and such. Do you think they diserve to live?


It would be a lot more usefull to make the criminals plant trees or something.

You say this and then try to minimize the importance of trees with your algae.


Also about the forests. We get most of our oxygen from algae in the sea.

In any case you are mostly right. Diatoms, which are algae in the broad sense of the word (any eukaryotic photosynthetic organism that is not a plant), are microscopic stramenopiles that are in the sea, but also in the dirt and in fresh water. They, in particular, are the #1 oxygen producing organism on the planet due to their high numbers.

But, that doesn't make trees and other plants useless, they still contribute a massive amount of oxygen. They will become more important as the earth fills with more breathing people, yet, as the earth fills with more breathing people we will destroy more trees and plants to accomodate these people. Makes a hell of a lot of sense....


And there are some ppl with serious health problems but also with a brilliant mind(Tom Hawkins is an example<-I'm not so sure of how to write his name)

Stephen Hawking?
You may have missed it but in my last post i said people with physical injury but a functional mind shouldn't be killed as we need brainpower, they just should be dead in a population with functional natural selection.

Kabraxis
10-08-2006, 09:30 PM
Oh and to that cannibal post, they get no fiber if they eat only the human body... they would get constipated... But hey cannibalism is a way to take care of criminals and brain dead people and get some use out of em...

NorseFTX
10-09-2006, 10:02 AM
I want to believe that every person has a right to live, even if they don't have the best of habits or the best abilities....
Once people are here, they have the right to fight!

I just think that people shouldn't bring people into the world when the world already can't accomodate them... (I've said this before XP)
It's not fair to them, since there already aren't enough resources for them, and it's not fair to everyone else, since they have to put aside their own resources in order to keep them alive....

But we can't just say, "Oh, sorry mister. We're going to kill you," and expect them to just simply say, "Okay"....
I think we should try our best for the people we have, but we shouldn't make too many more....

Kabraxis
10-09-2006, 11:38 AM
I just think that people shouldn't bring people into the world when the world already can't accomodate them... (I've said this before XP)
It's not fair to them, since there already aren't enough resources for them, and it's not fair to everyone else, since they have to put aside their own resources in order to keep them alive....

I agree with this, I wish people would not have so many kids but some people are selfish in that way.


But we can't just say, "Oh, sorry mister. We're going to kill you," and expect them to just simply say, "Okay"....

With criminals.. aside from the ones already in there, it would be a choice. If they want to risk death and rape a kid, their choice.

With brain dead peopel and mentally retarded people... they have the mental capacity of a chicken, so why do they have more of a right to life? We slaughter millions of chickens each year who are smarter than these people who we just try to make comfortable.

One of the biggest keys though is reducing birthrate. It'd be good if we could steralize people after their first kid but all the christians and such would cry unethical.

Joey
10-09-2006, 11:54 AM
Sephiroth beneficial to today's life?

Well let's look at Sephiroth's accomplishments so far:

Stared as a villian in the FFVII series.

Wow. Seriously, impressive resume right there.

Sephiroth and all memory of him is stored in a video game company's computer and that is it. Relating him to real life situations is a major waste of everyone's time.

NorseFTX
10-09-2006, 02:30 PM
XD
Maybe it is a waste of time, but it's kind of interesting and fun to discuss...
That's why we're doing it!

So it's not such a waste of time to us...because it's fun! =]

We're also talking about general global problems, so if you have anything you want to say, or have some ideas, feel free to share them!

Adamant Barrage
10-09-2006, 02:33 PM
;665704']Sephiroth beneficial to today's life?

Well let's look at Sephiroth's accomplishments so far:

Stared as a villian in the FFVII series.

Wow. Seriously, impressive resume right there.

Sephiroth and all memory of him is stored in a video game company's computer and that is it. Relating him to real life situations is a major waste of everyone's time.

Don't forget he's also a sidequest boss in both KH and KHII.

Kabraxis
10-09-2006, 05:26 PM
sigh.. i hate when people dont read, or just dont comprehend what they read, then post a reply.

Kabraxis
10-10-2006, 05:17 PM
Here is a link toa guy who was tohught more about this than i have, he does a good job of showing exactly why the population is a huge problem.

This is for all you out there with the attention span to read more than a sentence in 1337 speak at a time.

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

NorseFTX
10-10-2006, 05:41 PM
Mm...
I agree with a lot of what he says...
(Though I kind of don't like the "I don't care what you think" kind of tone...)

The only thing I don't agree with is "people in poverty breed more people in poverty."
Some of the people who grew up in poverty and found ways to be successful often have known struggle and hard work, and are some of the most good-hearted people I know. They have known pain....and through knowledge of these hardships, they know kindness and its value more than anyone.
They know how to moderate themselves, and know that having limits to their own freedom gives everyone in total more freedom.

This isn't everyone, of course...but there are some people like this, too.

Joey
10-10-2006, 07:47 PM
The fact is, it is easy to point out problems with society, any idiot can do that.

The fact that you dream and fantasize about a video game character lifting all problems and ignorance from the world is extremely childish.

Kabraxis
10-10-2006, 09:45 PM
Holy shit, again, try reading the thread.

I clearly said:

Oh and before you get to overexcited about the whoel sephiroth part, know that i just tacked that onto the beginning and end of my thoughts so that it could apply to the final fantasy forums. I wanted to make a thought provoking post that would bring about some good discussion for that contest that's going on, and had to apply it to final fantasy somehow...

Which words don't you understand? Maybe if you read the conversations you are about to go in and criticize, you won't expose your stupidity quite so much.

Norse, thank you for your not-stupid reply. I agree there are definatly people who pull themselves out of the dirt and are very successful, however i think he's going on average where like peopel who live in the ghettos end up getting in trouble and dropping out of school moreso than people who live out in the nice friendly neighborhood, because their family can afford to, do. It isn't a true statement in all cases but i dont think that's what he's trying to imply.

Darkiss
10-10-2006, 09:48 PM
Stephen Hawking?
You may have missed it but in my last post i said people with physical injury but a functional mind shouldn't be killed as we need brainpower, they just should be dead in a population with functional natural selection.

Yes,the thing is that,if I remember correctly,of course that a lot of money are being spent on ppl with serious medical prob and that's a waste in other words. But if the technology had not been advanced(in this sector), a genius such as St.Hawking could not express himself. Also,if remember correctly he was born with such probs. So, how could u give him a chance to show how brilliant a human can be? First wait to see if he is worthy and then what if he isn't?Dispose him?

I do see your point,really...Most ppl harm earth,not protect it.

And no, this hasn't anything to do with Sephiroth. he is just a char.(Although there is so much madness in the world today that there is always a possibility that one psycho will grab a katana and will start slaughter ppl.Once I had read a story that a player suffered from depression after he reached the game up to Aeris death!! I was shocked!! Let's get serious it's just a game.)

This thread is quite interesting.

Joey
10-10-2006, 09:49 PM
So, back to Sephiroth; wanting to use earth as a vessel to a new planet is closer to a logical ideal than anyone with power on earth has come up with as far as solving long term problems, because on the short term, yay we're living longer, but on the long term, the imminent doom of the human race and the planet draws closer because of our immature hedonistic consumption.

Well there you have it. Words you typed yourself that clearly prove that you did in fact relate a video game character to real life.
So please accept my bitching.

Kabraxis
10-11-2006, 01:30 AM
I dont deny saying that. I had to relate the thread to final fantasy somehow so i decided, going to another planet is similar to one of my ideas (spending money that goes to prisoners and such on technology to go to another planet) so why not use sephiroth to make it valid to the final fantasy forum.

Its not like he is the center of the discussion, i wouldn't care if he was completely forgotten.

I've had discussions on this topic with other peopel and at other forums, and even given it as a speech when in english class we were required to speak about a controversial issue. Never then did it include sephiroth, he was tacked on to the edges of this one because that was the only way i could make it valid for the contest thing.

It's really not quite "Dreaming and fantasizing" as you say, fool.

My goal here is to have a discussion about overpopulation and related ills, preferably with peopel who can read, not to discuss how t0tally l33t it w0uld b3 if s3ph1roth waz r34l!!!!11!1!eleven1!!

So if you want to take part in the discussion please try to come up with a statement or an argument with some logic behind it, if you are capable. If not, go somewhere else and interrupt a discussion with your immature attempts at demeaning someone because you disagree with them and dont have the capacity to make a logical retort.

Zell/Cloud
10-22-2006, 10:08 AM
THAT SONDS PRETTY COOL BUT I AM A LVL. 89 AND HAVE OMNISLASH SO I WOULD JUST BE ABLE TO KILL HIM ANYWAY.

YEAH I CAN TOP THAT I BEAT EMERALD RUBY ULTIMA OMEGA DIAMOND AND JADE WEAPON. OH YEAH I AGREE ALL THE WAY EXCEPT IM TEN LVLS HIGHER.
SORRY IF I SOUND LIKE AN ASS

labrat
10-24-2006, 05:19 PM
((Wow, I've been gone from this site for well over a year and what a time to come back.))

Please forgive me with this first post. I haven't had too much time to collect my thoughts properly.

I myself find these arguments quite interesting. In all honesty I do agree with the fact that there is something wrong with the human race and the way the mind works. I completely agree with your statements on those criminals that are really not worth attempting to save and with humans who have no function to the world. Harsh as it sounds there really is no point in wasting resources on them.

It would indeed be a good idea to start to look at other worlds to see if they are hospitable by humans but eventually that world would also suffer the fate of this one.

Unfortunately I must take my leave and head on to school. I'll try to be back sometime this week...>,>

z.zetsumei
10-26-2006, 01:53 AM
i really can't be bothered to read all of this bullshit...so i'll leave you all with a summary of my thoughts

[Only registered and activated users can see links]

Mr.Hazard
10-26-2006, 06:31 AM
Well, all I can say here is that when I've read the first couple of sentences on the first post of this thread, I'd nearly fell into a deep coma from the ray of boredom emitting from my monitor. :o